May 07, 2025 Public Safety Committee (trimmed)

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READY? THERE'S JJ. GOOD AFTERNOON. THE TIME IS 4:03 P.M. THIS IS THE REGULARLY

[Call to Order]

[Roll Call]

WE'VE GOT FOUR ITEMS ON THE AGENDA THAT INCLUDE THREE PIECES OF LEGISLATION. PLEASE NOTE WE TAKE UP ITEMS. NUMBER TWO, R-03625 AND NUMBER 30-08725. FOLLOWING THE SPECIAL DISCUSSION. ITEM NUMBER 4R-029-25 WILL BE HELD IN COMMITTEE AT THE REQUEST OF THE SPONSOR, COUNCILWOMAN SHAMIKA PARISH. RIGHT. TODAY WE'RE JOINED BY MAJOR KYLE FISCHETTI.

[1. ID 25-0282     DRONE FIRST RESPONDER PROGRAM – Major Kyle Fekete, Louisville Fire Department and Travis Eicher, Louisville Metro Police Department and Trevin Hunter, Emergency Management Agency]

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DIFFERENT VENDORS HAVE DIFFERENT CAPABILITIES. AND WE REALLY HAVEN'T GOTTEN THAT FAR INTO IT JUST YET. BUT COMMONLY WE'RE SEEING ABOUT A TWO MILE RADIUS AT THIS POINT. AND ANOTHER QUESTION DRONE COORDINATES. HOW DO YOU COORDINATE THE HOW DO YOU KNOW WHERE THEY'RE AT? DO YOU USE GPS COORDINATES THROUGH LIVE? BROADCASTS? THAT'S A THAT'S A GREAT QUESTION. SO YES, THE WE WOULD USE DRONE SENSE OR A SIMILAR SOFTWARE PLATFORM THAT ALLOWS THE PILOTS TO FLY THAT WOULD INGEST ADS-B. SO WE COULD SEE WHERE AIRCRAFT ARE IN THE SKY. WE COULD SEE WHERE OTHER DRONES ARE. AND THEN TODAY WE YOU KNOW, WE ARE COORDINATING ALREADY BETWEEN AGENCIES. IF WE'RE FLYING TOGETHER AT A LARGE INCIDENT, YOU KNOW, WE'RE COMMUNICATING OVER RADIO AND SHARING OUR SCREENS AND, AND JUST TALKING WITH ONE ANOTHER TO HELP COORDINATE. BUT SAFETY IS PARAMOUNT. AND WE'RE WORKING WITH THE FAA TO MAKE SURE WE'RE STAYING IN LINES WITH ALL THE BOUNDARIES AND, AND REQUIREMENTS THAT THEY HAVE IN PLACE. ONE MORE NIGHT VISION. YOU HAVE NIGHT VISION CAPABILITIES. SO THEY HAVE THERMAL IMAGERY ON THEM, AND THEN THEY ARE ABLE TO FLY AT NIGHT IF THEY HAVE APPROPRIATE LIGHTING. I THINK IT HAS TO BE SIX NAUTICAL MILES FOR THE BEACON. THANK YOU. HAVE A COUPLE PEOPLE IN THE QUEUE. VICE CHAIR TAMMY HAWKINS, PLEASE. POP UP. OKAY. THANK YOU. CHAIR. THANKS FOR BEING HERE TODAY. I'M IN FULL SUPPORT OF DRONES. ONE OF MY BIGGEST CONCERNS IS DISTRICT 12 AND DISTRICT 14. BOTH. YOU KNOW, PUT MONEY IN FOR DRONES A YEAR AGO, AND THAT STILL HAS NOT CAME TO FRUITION. SO I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW THE TIMELINE ON, YOU KNOW, WHEN THESE DRONES ARE GOING TO BE ACTIVE. IT'S BEEN A YEAR AND

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AFTER SPEAKING WITH OUR LEGAL DEPARTMENT AND SOME OTHERS, THERE'S A LOT OF REGULATIONS, A LOT OF RED TAPE TO GET THROUGH TO GET PILOTS TRAINED, MAKE SURE OUR POLICY LINES UP WITH BEST PRACTICES IN THE INDUSTRY, AND MAKE SURE THAT, YOU KNOW, WE'RE LINING UP WITH WHAT THE FAA SAYS AN AGENCY SHOULD COMPLY WITH. SEVERAL OF THOSE DRONES THAT WERE PURCHASED, THOUGH, HAVE BEEN DEPLOYED BY THE FIVE PILOTS THAT WE HAVE CURRENTLY IN THE DEPARTMENT. I CAN'T SPEAK TO AN EXACT NUMBER, BUT I THINK THE LAST TIME I CHECKED, WE HAD OVER LIKE 200 OR SO DEPLOYMENTS WITH THOSE AIRCRAFT FOR SPECIAL EVENTS. I KNOW, FOR INSTANCE, THE CAR, THE STREET RACING DETAILS, THEY WERE UTILIZED QUITE A BIT FOR THAT. AND THEN VARIOUS CALL OUTS, BARRICADED SUBJECTS. EVERY SWAT CALL OUT THAT WE'VE DONE, I THINK FOR THE PAST YEAR OR SO, HAS HAD ONE OF THOSE AIRCRAFT ACCOMPANIED. OKAY, SO BASICALLY YOU'RE SAYING THAT THAT THE THAT THOSE DRONES HAVE BEEN ACTIVE. YES, MA'AM. NOT ALL OF THEM. I CAN'T SAY ALL OF THEM. WE DID PURCHASE ONE FOR EACH DIVISION, AND I THINK FIVE OF THEM CURRENTLY ARE BEING UTILIZED. WE DO HAVE A PROGRAM IN PLACE NOW THAT HAS SOME MORE STRUCTURE. WE'VE WE'RE GOING TO START WITH ONE DIVISION AT A TIME. SO THE THIRD DIVISION WILL GET THE FIRST ONE. THEY'VE GOT TWO PILOTS NAMED RIGHT NOW THAT ARE OFFICERS IN THE THIRD DIVISION. THEY SHOULD HAVE THEIR PART 107 IN THE NEXT 30 TO 45 DAYS. IT TAKES A LITTLE BIT TO GET THAT CERTIFICATE. THEY'VE GOT TO DO SOME STUDYING, TAKE A TEST AT BOWMAN FIELD ONCE THAT 107 CERTIFICATE HAS BEEN RECEIVED BY THEM, WE'LL GET THEM THE AIRCRAFT OUT TO THE THIRD DIVISION AND WE'LL START ROLLING OUT FROM THERE. OKAY. WELL, WE MET WITH MYSELF AND MY COLLEAGUE, CHAIR SAMS. WE MET WITH CHIEF HUMPHREYS, AND HE STATED THAT THEY DIDN'T HAVE ENOUGH MANPOWER TO TRAIN FOR THE DRONE PROGRAM YET, AND THAT AND THAT'S WHY IT STILL HAS NOT BEEN IMPLEMENTED BY LMPD DIVISION. SO IT'S A, YOU KNOW, CAN YOU CLEAR THAT UP? YEAH. WE YOU KNOW, OVERSIGHT IS A BIG THING THAT'S ENCOURAGED WHEN YOU START A DRONE PROGRAM LIKE THAT. SO THAT WAS KIND OF SOME OF THE HESITATION. WE WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT THERE WAS GOING TO BE LEADERSHIP IN PLACE TO HAVE OVERSIGHT OVER THAT PROGRAM, WHICH WHICH LED TO SOME OF THE HESITANCY OF PUSHING THAT OUT TO ALL EIGHT DIVISIONS WITHOUT ONE KIND OF CENTRALIZED UNIT OVERSEEING IT. IT NOW HAS A HAS A HOME. THEY'RE IN THE PROCESS OF, I BELIEVE, WITH THIS NEXT BUDGET CYCLE OF GETTING SUPERVISOR IN PLACE SPECIFIC FOR THAT DRONE PROGRAM, WHICH WILL DEFINITELY HELP GOING FORWARD. OKAY. IT'S JUST A CONFLICT THAT I WAS KIND OF HEARING, BUT JUST IF YOU WOULD KEEP THOSE AGAIN, I'M IN FULL SUPPORT FOR THE DRONES, BUT, YOU KNOW, I JUST WOULD LIKE FOR YOU TO KEEP MY COLLEAGUES IN THE LOOP ON FUNDING THAT WAS SPENT IN THEIR DISTRICTS FOR THOSE DRONES, BECAUSE I THINK I CAN SPEAK FOR THE ENTIRE COUNCIL WAS KIND OF LOOKING FORWARD TO BEING UPDATED ABOUT THAT DRONE PROGRAM, TO KNOW IF WE WANTED TO MOVE FORWARD WITH HAVING ANY MORE OR INVEST IN ANY MORE. THANK YOU.

NEXT IN QUEUE WOULD BE COUNCIL MEMBER BETSY ROWLEY, PLEASE. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. SO MY QUESTION IS WE HAVE A LIMITED NUMBER OF DRONES RIGHT NOW. I'M GLAD YOU DO HAVE THEM IN THIRD DIVISION BECAUSE THAT DOES AFFECT IROQUOIS PARK, WHERE WE HAVE A LOT OF ISSUES WITH MOTORCYCLES AND DIRT BIKES RIDING ON THE TRAILS. SO MY QUESTION IS RIGHT PLACE, RIGHT

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SO THESE AIRCRAFT WILL BE IN DOCKS ACTUALLY STATIONED ON ROOFTOPS THROUGHOUT THE CITY.

AND THEY'LL BE OPERATED BY REMOTE PILOT THAT'S LOCATED AT METRO SAFE. SO THEY DEPLOY OUT OF THE DOCK, YOU KNOW, AGAIN, IT'S ONE OF THOSE THINGS THAT CHANGES VENDOR TO VENDOR, BUT THE AVERAGE IS 30S TO A MINUTE. THE DOCK HAS TO OPEN, THEN THE AIRCRAFT LAUNCHES AUTOMATICALLY.

SO THESE ARE ACTUALLY, YOU KNOW, MOST OF THE SYSTEMS THAT WE'VE LOOKED AT HAVE INTEGRATED WITH THE CAD SYSTEM, THE DISPATCH. SO IF A RUN MEETS THE QUALIFICATIONS OF A DFR RUN IT WILL SEND THAT TO THE DOCK. IT LAUNCHES ON ITS OWN, IT STARTS FLYING TOWARDS THE LOCATION PROVIDED BY CAD. AND SO AT THAT TIME IT'S 40 MILES AN HOUR. I THINK THAT'S WHERE WE'RE AT. SO AT 40 MILES AN HOUR, THEY'LL FLY STRAIGHT LINE TO THE LOCATION. SO SURE, THERE'S SOME MATH IN THERE BASED ON WHERE THE DOCK IS LOCATED, BUT IT'S PRETTY QUICK. IT'S MUCH FASTER THAN THE PATROL DEPLOYMENT THAT WE HAD TALKED BEFORE. YOU HAVE TO WAIT ON SOMEBODY TO DRIVE THERE, GET THIS THING OUT OF THEIR TRUNK. LAUNCH IT. YEAH, THAT WAS MY PICTURE. SO, YEAH, THAT WOULD BE MUCH FASTER THAN POPPING IT OUT OF THE TRUNK OF YOUR CAR AND GETTING IT UP IN THE AIR. YEAH.

OKAY. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. IF I COULD JUST ADD TO THAT FROM THE FIRE SERVICE PERSPECTIVE, WITH THE CURRENT DEPLOYMENT THAT WE'VE GOT PROPOSED FOR YEAR ONE, IT COVERS MOST OF THE URBAN SERVICES DISTRICT BECAUSE THOSE ARE ALL CITY OWNED HOUSES, CITY OWNED FIREHOUSES THAT WE DON'T HAVE TO GET INTO AN MOU WITH SUBURBAN AGENCY. THIS GIVES US TIME TO TEST IT, TO PROVE THE PROGRAM AND THEN TO GROW IT OUTWARD. SO IF YOU CAN JUMP OVER TO YOUR YEAR TWO, WE WOULD EXPAND IT OR PLAN TO EXPAND IT. AFTER PROVING IT INTO THE SUBURBAN SERVICES DISTRICT. AND THEN A YEAR SIX COVERS MUCH OF THE CITY AND COUNTY AS WE CAN, BUT FROM THE FIRE SERVICE SIDE OF IT, WITH WHAT TRAVIS HAS SAID AND GETTING THAT EARLY JUMP OF NOT HAVING TO DRIVE TO A SCENE AND LAUNCH THE DRONE, IT'S GOING TO GIVE OUR COMPANY OFFICERS MINUTES TO MAKE DECISIONS, WHEREAS RIGHT NOW THEY HAVE JUST A FEW SECONDS. SO ON THE WAY THERE, WE'VE GOT IPADS MOUNTED TO EVERY APPARATUS. THEY'LL BE ABLE TO LOOK DOWN AND SEE IF THEY'VE GOT FIRE IN THE BASEMENT, FIRE IN THE ATTIC, PEOPLE HANGING OUT OF WINDOWS AND START WORKING ON WHAT THEIR GAME PLAN IS TO MITIGATE THOSE HAZARDS. SO IT'S A HUGE SITUATIONAL AWARENESS TOOL FOR US AND A GIANT LEAP FORWARD. OKAY. SO THESE ARE THESE ARE INSTALLED ON FIREHOUSES THEN.

YES. THAT'S WHAT THE PROPOSAL IS, IS ON YEAR ONE WOULD BE ON EIGHT FIREHOUSES AROUND THE CITY. OKAY. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. YEAH. THANK YOU. BEFORE WE GO ANY FURTHER, I WANT TO RECOGNIZE COUNCIL MEMBER ANTHONY PIAGENTINI, WHO'S JOINED US. NEXT PERSON IN QUEUE WOULD BE COUNCILMAN JONATHAN JOSEPH, PLEASE. THANK YOU. I ECHO WITH WHAT COUNCILWOMAN HAWKINS WAS SAYING IN REGARDS TO JUST THE IMPLEMENTATION AND HOW MUCH MONEY HAS BEEN PUT INTO, EVEN THOUGH IT WAS THE INDIVIDUAL BEFORE ME THAT PUT INTO THAT INVESTMENT. AND I JUST GOT A DISCUSSION TODAY ABOUT FLOCK CAMERAS THAT WERE PURCHASED IN, I THINK, SEPTEMBER AND STILL HAVE NOT BEEN PLACED YET. SO AM I RIGHT IN SAYING THAT YOU'RE SAYING LIKELY THAT WITHIN 30 TO 45 DAYS IS WHEN THE THIRD DIVISION WILL BE UP AND RUNNING WITH WITH THIS TECHNOLOGY? YES.

AND THAT IS A TRAINED POLICE OFFICER THAT WORKS WITHIN THE THIRD DIVISION. YES, YES, THAT'S SEPARATE FROM THE BFR PROGRAM, BUT YES, 30 TO 45 DAYS. ONCE THEY GET THEIR 107 CERTIFICATE, THEY'LL BE READY TO GO. AND THAT IS AN OFFICER THAT JUST KEEPS IT IN THEIR TRUNK. AND IF THEY NEED TO GET TO A CERTAIN PLACE, THEY GET THERE AND THEN THEY CAN DEPLOY IT UP PER SE. YES, SIR.

IS THE AGAIN, I'M IGNORANT TO THIS BECAUSE I'M NOT IN ANY PROFESSIONAL REGARDING DRONE TECHNOLOGY. IS IT TRUE THAT YOU HAVE TO BE IN EYESIGHT OF THE DRONE FOR THE DRONE TO BE ABLE TO FLY FOR THE PATROL DEPLOYMENT THAT YOU'RE REFERRING TO IN THE THIRD DIVISION? YES, WE DO HAVE A TACTICAL WE HAVE OUR TACTICAL. TACTICAL BEYOND VISUAL LINE OF SIGHT WAIVER FOR THE CITY, WHICH BASICALLY SAYS, YOU KNOW, IN THE EXECUTION OF AN OPERATION, IF YOU HAVE TO FLY BEHIND A BUILDING TEMPORARILY, WE ARE PERMITTED BY THE FAA TO DO THAT. OKAY. AND THEN THE LAST THING I HAVE IS SO THE THIRD DIVISION WOULD HAVE IT, BUT THE FIRE DEPARTMENT CAN USE IT AS WELL.

IS THAT KIND OF THE VIBE THAT I'M GETTING IS THAT EMERGENCY SERVICES ALSO CAN USE IT. YES.

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THE BUDGET IS THAT DRONE FIRST RESPONDER. IT'S TWO TOTALLY DIFFERENT THINGS. AND WITH BFR, THEY'RE IN DOCKS AND CAN BE THERE WITHIN JUST A COUPLE OF MINUTES. SO IT'S IMPORTANT TO KNOW THAT THEY'RE THEY'RE TWO VERY DIFFERENT THINGS WHERE YOU DON'T HAVE TO HAVE 3 OR 4 PERSONNEL IN EACH FOR US, A BATTALION OR FOR THE POLICE DEPARTMENT DIVISION TRAINED THAT ARE ROTATING ONE DRONE AROUND. THIS IS ONE POSITION THAT SITS AT METRO SAFE, IN A REMOTE OPERATIONS CENTER THAT WE'RE PROPOSING TO STAFF 24 OVER SEVEN 365 THAT AT ANY TIME COULD LAUNCH ANY OF THOSE DRONES AROUND THE CITY. AND ALSO US BEING PILOTS CAN JUMP IN IF THEY'RE BUSY AND LAUNCH THEM FROM OUR OFFICE AS WELL. WE CAN JUST LOG IN AND FLY FROM OUR OFFICE. SO IT TAKES THAT THAT ASPECT OF HAVING TO HAVE SO MANY TRAINED PERSONNEL OUT AND ALLOWS US TO JUST STAFF THAT ONE POSITION AT METRO SAFE AROUND THE CLOCK TO BE ABLE TO LAUNCH ANYWHERE IN THE CITY. THANK YOU. NEXT IN QUEUE WOULD BE JENNY MULVEY. WOOLRIDGE, PLEASE. THANK YOU. FIRST ONE TO SAY I AM IN FULL SUPPORT OF THIS. I THINK IT'S AN AMAZING OPPORTUNITY AND FOR US TO CONTINUE TO GROW, A FEW QUESTIONS I HAVE IS I KNOW THAT IN THE PAST THOSE SMALL, LOW LYING AIRCRAFTS, DOES THIS HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH THAT? WILL IT INTERFERE WITH AIRCRAFT OR ANYTHING THAT IS FLYING IN THE AREA? SO AS WE LOOK TO DEVELOP THIS PROGRAM, WE'RE WORKING HAND IN HAND WITH THE FAA. IT'S A SIGNIFICANT PAPERWORK PROCESS TO GET THE APPROPRIATE WAIVERS TO BE ABLE TO FLY. WE'RE LOOKING AT PROBABLY OPERATING BELOW 200FT.

SO STEERING CLEAR OF MANNED AVIATION. AND THERE ARE CERTAIN RULES IN PLACE THAT THAT WHEN YOU TAKE THAT PART 107 CERTIFICATION, YOU AGREE TO ADHERE TO, YOU KNOW, SUCH AS GIVING WAY TO A MANNED AIRCRAFT. SO IF WE SEE AN AIRCRAFT IN THE AREA, WE AVOID THAT AREA. WE COME DOWN LOWER OR EVEN LAND THE AIRCRAFT. IF WE THINK THAT THERE'S A SAFETY HAZARD THAT WE CAN PREVENT. OKAY. THANK YOU. I THINK THAT WAS ALL I HAD. YEAH. THAT'S IT FOR NOW. THANK YOU.

THANK YOU MA'AM. THANK YOU. ANOTHER 1AQ COUNCILMAN ANTHONY PIAGENTINI, PLEASE ONLINE. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. CAN YOU HEAR ME? OKAY. CAN CAN YOU HEAR ME IN CHAMBERS? OKAY. CAN HEAR YOU.

FINE. YES. PROCEED. OKAY. PERFECT. THANK YOU. REALLY? NOT A QUESTION. JUST. JUST TO REFLECT MY SUPPORT OF THIS, I KNOW THAT WE MENTIONED THAT VICE CHAIR HAWKINS MENTIONED SOME DISTRICTS WHO PUT IN MONEY AT THE END OF LAST YEAR. THE SUPPORT OF THIS PROGRAM PREDATES THAT SIGNIFICANTLY. AS A MATTER OF FACT, WHEN MAYOR GREENBERG WAS FIRST ELECTED, HIS FIRST CHIEF OF POLICE, I TOLD VERY SPECIFICALLY THAT IF SHE DID NOT INCLUDE DRONE TECHNOLOGY

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THE NO CHASE POLICY. HOW DOES THAT PLAY INTO DRONE ACTIVITY AND APPREHENSION? TRAVIS, ARE YOU ABLE TO SPEAK TO THAT? I'M NOT ABLE TO SPEAK TO THAT. THAT'S NOT THAT IS NOT SOMETHING THAT'S BEEN DISCUSSED YET INTERNALLY. I'M SURE AS WE DEVELOP THE POLICY FOR VFR THAT WILL ABSOLUTELY BE ADDRESSED. IS THAT SOMETHING THAT AN ORDINANCE IS GOING TO HAVE TO COVER OR. I CAN'T SPEAK TO THAT. I'M SORRY. WHAT ABOUT APPREHENSION WHEN YOU SEE THESE THESE GUYS AND I'M, I'M CONCERNED ABOUT THESE THESE ATV GANGS WE'VE GOT GOING UP AND DOWN. DIXIE. IF YOU FIND ONE, YOU SEE ONE GO UP INTO A GARAGE. YOU GOT IT ON FILM. WHAT DO YOU DO? IS THAT GOING TO BE WORKED OUT? I STILL. CRIMES OKAY. I'LL HAVE TO DEFER THAT ONE TO THE, THE CHIEF AND THE POLICY PIECE THERE. I THINK THAT THERE ARE DEFINITELY THINGS THAT WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO LOOK AT AS, YOU KNOW, AS YOU MENTIONED, THE CHASE POLICY AND THINGS LIKE THAT. AS FAR AS THE ATV THINGS WE DID, ONE OF THE VIDEOS THAT'S INCLUDED IN THERE IS US DOING A TEST OF ONE OF THESE AIRCRAFT BEFORE WE PURCHASED, AND WE'RE ABLE TO SUCCESSFULLY FOLLOW ONE OF THOSE THROUGHOUT THE FOREST AT THE BOAT DOCKS AT THE GREENWOOD BOAT RAMP. SO I THINK THERE'S DEFINITELY AN OPPORTUNITY THERE FOR THIS. THE ISSUE BECOMES THE DISTANCE PIECE. WE CAN WE CAN GO FOR ABOUT, YOU KNOW, AS FAR AS WE CAN SEE RIGHT NOW WITH THE PATROL DEPLOYMENT, THE BFR DEPLOYMENT, WE'VE GOT ABOUT TWO MILES. THERE'S DEFINITELY SOME COORDINATION ALSO WITH OTHER DOCKS. SO ONE LAUNCHES AND IS ABLE TO FOLLOW THEM, YOU KNOW, DOWN DIXIE HIGHWAY, FOR INSTANCE. IF ANOTHER ONE CAN PICK UP AND TAKE TAKE IT FROM THERE. THAT'S POSSIBLE AS WELL.

AS FAR AS THE APPREHENSION PIECE OF IT, I CAN'T I CAN'T SPEAK TO THE, THE LEGALITIES OF, OF USING THAT SPECIFICALLY FOR APPREHENSION. IF YOU'VE IF YOU'VE SEEN THEM WITNESS A CRIME, I WOULD ASSUME YOU WOULD BE ABLE TO OPERATE OFF THAT. I KNOW HISTORICALLY WE'VE USED IT FOR STREET RACING, WHICH SEEMS LIKE A VERY SIMILAR ISSUE. SO WE WERE ABLE TO VIDEOTAPE DOING BURNOUTS IN A PARKING LOT AND THEN STATION A TRAFFIC OFFICER DOWN THE STREET THAT WAS ABLE TO APPREHEND THEM AS THEY LEFT THE PARKING LOT SAFELY. AND THIS THIS VIDEO IS WE CAN INCLUDE THAT IN IN CONVICTIONS IN COURT CASES IT IT'S ADMISSIBLE. YES, YES YES, OFFICER. STATE YOUR NAME. OFFICER. STEVEN ROEDERER I WAS ACTUALLY THERE DURING THE APPREHENSION OF THOSE VEHICLES.

FOR THE LEGAL SIDE OF THINGS, I SURVEILLANCE TOOL. WE'RE NOT GOING TO USE THIS TO DO ANY TYPE OF INVESTIGATIVE SURVEILLANCE. NOW, WHEN WE'RE WE'RE OUT DOING, LIKE, THE TRAFFIC POINTS AND

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COUNCILMAN KEN HERNDON, PLEASE. I'M SORRY. THAT COULD BE HUMAN ERROR. WELL, IT'S NOT IN HERE.

SO YOU'RE THERE. WELL, IT'S READY. WE GOT YOU, BUDDY. OKAY, THE FOLLOW UP ON THAT. SO JUST SO I UNDERSTAND, IF WE END UP HAVING TO DO SOME KIND OF LEGISLATION. SO. WHAT TRIGGERS YOU CAN'T YOU CAN'T JUST HANG OVER MY HOUSE AND WAIT TILL I DO SOMETHING. I GET THAT, BUT WHAT TRIGGERS THE LEGAL USE? YOU HAVE TO HAVE AN INCIDENT OCCURRING A REPORT OR WHAT IS THE EXACT TRIGGER THAT THAT MAKES THAT OKAY TO. SO I THINK THAT'S GOING TO BE BASED ON WHAT THE CALL IS.

SO LIKE FOR THE VFR PROGRAM, THERE ARE TWO DIFFERENT TWO DIFFERENT REASONS WE WOULD DEPLOY LIKE FOR THE PATROL LEAD, IF SOMEBODY FLEES FROM AN OFFICER, RIGHT, GETTING A FOOT CHASE AT THAT POINT, ANOTHER OFFICER THAT'S ON THE STREET CAN DEPLOY THE PATROL LEAD DRONE RIGHT, AND FOLLOW THEM. THERE WAS ACTUALLY ONE THE FOOT CHASE THAT WAS ON THE VIDEO WAS ONE THAT I DID FOR OUR FUGITIVE UNIT. SO THERE'S THAT INSTANCE WHERE MISSING PERSONS, MAYBE SEARCHING FIELDS. I MEAN, IT CAN BE USED FOR A VARIETY OF THINGS AS FAR AS LIKE CAR CHASES, PATROL, IT'S NOT GOING TO BE USED. LIKE TRAVIS MENTIONED, THE VFR PROGRAM ALLOWS FOR VARIOUS DRONES TO BE USED AT THE SAME TIME. SO IF THE AIR UNITS DOWN, IT PROVIDES THE ABILITY TO FOLLOW THAT CAR WITHOUT ACTUALLY HAVING TO DO A LINE OF SIGHT TYPE OF THING FROM THE PATROL LEAD ASPECT. BUT I THINK IN TERMS OF THE CALL FOR SERVICE, IT'S REALLY JUST DEPENDENT. AND THERE ARE TWO DIFFERENT SEPARATE THINGS. YEAH. SO THAT'S SOMETHING THAT OFFICIALLY NEEDS TO BE ESTABLISHED, WHICH I THINK WE'VE DONE REALLY GOOD AT FOR THE PATROL STUFF. I'VE PUSHED THAT REALLY HARD, ESPECIALLY FOR OUR SEARCH WARRANT STUFF. FULL TIME MEMBER OF SWAT. WE USE IT ON EVERY OPERATION TO PROVIDE THAT INTELLIGENCE, BUT PRIOR TO US GETTING ON SCENE. BUT AT THAT POINT WE HAVE A SEARCH WARRANT. SO IT'S SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT. OKAY. SO YOU GET A TRIGGER CALL AND YOU GO OUT AND SURVEIL. BUT THEN IF YOU'RE OUT THERE AND YOU SEE SOMETHING ELSE HAPPENING THAT MAY BE ILLEGAL, NOT THIS THAT YOU'RE LOOKING FOR, BUT YOU SEE SOMETHING ELSE, THIS YOU CAN USE THAT FILM FOR THIS IN PROSECUTION. BUT IF YOU SEE THIS HAPPENING, CAN YOU DO YOU IGNORE THAT? I MEAN, NOT LIKE MURDER, MAYHEM, BUT I MEAN, ANYTHING THAT, YOU KNOW, HOW DO YOU HOW DO YOU HANDLE IF YOU'RE LOOKING FOR ISSUE A AND YOU SEE ISSUE B OCCURRING IN THAT IN THAT AREA.

SO WE HAVEN'T OFFICIALLY WE NEED TO ESTABLISH THAT. YEAH. MOVING FORWARD ON ON WHAT WE CAN AND TO SPEAK TO LEGAL IN TERMS OF THAT. IT'S SIMILAR TO LIKE THE AIR UNIT YOU KNOW, SAME AS USING THE HELICOPTER. BUT I THINK THERE'S A LITTLE MORE RED TAPE WITH DRONES JUST AS THEY'RE BEING AS THEY'RE NEW, THEY'RE MOVING AS, YOU KNOW, SOME PRIVACY ISSUES, ETC, YOU KNOW. ABSOLUTELY. AND SO THE UNITS THEMSELVES ARE $7,800 A PIECE. IS THAT CORRECT? IS THAT THAT'S THAT'S FOR THE PATROL. THAT'S FOR THE PATROL LEADER. YEAH. FOR THE FOR THE VFR PROGRAM THAT WE'RE HERE LIKE IN YEAR ONE. HOW MANY, HOW MANY? THERE WAS EIGHT. EIGHT. YES, SIR. WHAT WAS THE COST PER LOCATION? APPROXIMATELY $50,000 PER LOCATION. YES, FOR THE FULL LOAD IN IN. YES. WHAT'S WHAT ON YEAR SIX. HOW MANY WERE ON THAT LIST ON YEAR SIX? THERE IS A TOTAL OF 20 TO COVER AS MUCH OF THE POPULATED AREA OF JEFFERSON COUNTY AS WE CAN. OKAY. AND WOULD THAT BE SATURATION? WOULD THAT BE WHAT YOU DONE OR WHAT YOU THINK? YOU KNOW, THAT'S GOING TO BE PRETTY CLOSE TO WHERE WE'RE GETTING THE ALL THE MAJOR POPULATED AREAS OF JEFFERSON COUNTY. OKAY. I GUESS I'M QUESTIONING THAT. THAT'S THAT'S NOT A WHOLE LOT OF MONEY FOR FULL. WHY WOULD WE WAIT SIX YEARS TO GET TO THAT LEVEL OF SATURATED COVERAGE? AM I NAIVE OR IS IT'S MONEY? OBVIOUSLY. BUT IS IT ALSO PERSONNEL, BANDWIDTH, ETC? YEAH, IT'S WE WANT TO TEST THE CONCEPT. WE'RE NOT REINVENTING THE WHEEL HERE. YEAH. WITHIN THE LAST YEAR, THERE'S BEEN SEVERAL SIGNIFICANT LEAPS IN FAA REGULATIONS THAT'S ALLOWED US WITH THE 200 FOOT NUMBER THAT'S BEEN MENTIONED.

WE'RE MODELING THAT AFTER NYPD PROGRAM. SO NYPD RECEIVED A WAIVER LAST FALL. AND WE WERE

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ABSOLUTELY. OKAY. ALSO TO TOUCH ON THERE'S A TRANSPARENCY BUILT INTO THIS WITH EVERY MAJOR VENDOR THAT WE'VE LOOKED AT. YOU KNOW, WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THE SURVEILLANCE SIDE OF IT. THERE'S EVERY FLIGHT GETS LOGGED AND WILL BE AVAILABLE ON A PUBLIC FACING DASHBOARD. SO IF YOU ARE WORRIED ABOUT A DRONE FLYING OVER YOUR HOUSE AT 3:00 IN THE MORNING, YOU CAN GO SEE WHERE IT WAS LAUNCHED FROM, ROUGHLY WHERE IT WAS GOING TO FOR PRIVACY ISSUES. YOU KNOW, IT'LL GIVE YOU A ROUGH IDEA OF WHERE IT WENT AND A GENERAL IDEA OF WHAT IT WAS THERE FOR, WHAT THE DISPOSITION WAS. DO YOU HAVE ANOTHER MINOR THING? DO YOU EVER SEND MORE THAN 1 TO 1 INCIDENT, MORE THAN ONE DRONE? WE DO. IN CASE YOU WANT TO CHASE MORE. YOU WANT TO FOLLOW MORE THAN ONE OR WHATEVER. FROM THE FIRE SIDE WE DO ON MULTIPLE INCIDENTS, WE'LL PUT THEM ON DIFFERENT SIDES OF LARGE BUILDINGS WHERE WE PARTNER WITH EMA OR WITH OUR PILOTS, WHERE WE CAN, INSTEAD OF HAVING A DRONE ORBIT AND ONLY SEEING ONE SIDE OF THE BUILDING AT A TIME, WE CAN PUT IT ON TWO OPPOSING CORNERS AND HAVE A TOTAL 360 ALL THE TIME FOR OUR INCIDENT COMMANDER AND OUR OFFICERS TO MAKE DECISIONS. SAME QUESTION TO POLICE. I MEAN, DO YOU IF YOU IF YOU HAVE A PEEL OUT PARTY AND YOU WANT TO TRY TO CHASE MORE THAN ONE, I MEAN, DO YOU IS THAT THAT'S BASED ON HOW MANY PILOTS WE HAVE ON SCENE AT THE TIME, THERE'S BEEN ONLY A HANDFUL OF TIMES WHERE WE'VE HAD MULTIPLE PILOTS ON SCENE, BECAUSE AT THE SAME TIME, WHEN WE HAVE A SEARCH WARRANT FOR CARS, WE USE THE INDOOR DRONE AS WELL, AS LONG AS IT'S IN THE SEARCH WARRANT. SURE. SO IT'S BASED ON HOW MANY PILOTS WE HAVE ON SCENE. OKAY. I THINK IT'S AN INVALUABLE TOOL THAT I SUPPORT.

I JUST WOULD LIKE TO GET US TO SATURATION FASTER IF WE THINK IT'S GOING TO WORK WELL. SO THANKS. THANK YOU. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIRMAN. THANK YOU. I HAVE ONE LAST QUESTION. FOR THE SAKE OF TIME, SHAMIKA PARISH. RIGHT, PLEASE. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. THE GOOD THING ABOUT WAITING TILL LAST, YOU HEAR A LOT OF YOUR QUESTIONS ANSWERED. SO THANK YOU ALL FOR BEING SO THOROUGH. AND THANK YOU FOR, YOU KNOW, SHOWING THE DISTINCTION BETWEEN, YOU KNOW, LEGALITIES, INTELLIGENCE AND SURVEILLANCE. THOSE ARE DIFFERENT THINGS TO DIFFERENT PEOPLE. AND THEN ALSO COVERING THE PRIVACY THING, IT WAS GOOD TO HEAR ABOUT THE PUBLIC FACING DATABASE THAT WILL LET PEOPLE SEE THE FLIGHT PATTERNS. BECAUSE MY OTHER QUESTION WAS IF I WAS A TRAINED OFFICER AND SAY I WANTED TO JUST LAUNCH IT TO FOLLOW SOMEONE, IT SEEMS LIKE THERE'S SOME KIND OF TRACKING FOR THAT. JUST AND LIKE A, LIKE THE OFFICERS HAVE BODY CAMS, RIGHT? SO THERE'S SOME BUILT IN PRIVACY AND PROTECTION. AND I GUESS MY QUESTION IS AROUND IS IT ONE ONE OFFICER PER BECAUSE I HEARD YOU SAY $50,000 PER SITE. RIGHT. SO FOR THE EIGHT FIREHOUSES, IS THAT 50,000 A YEAR TO RUN THOSE FROM THOSE LOCATIONS, OR IS IT TO SET IT UP AND EVERYTHING? THAT'S CORRECT.

SO IT'S $50,000 PER YEAR PER SITE. OKAY. AND THAT'S IF WE JUST HAVE TO GET THE DRONE TO THE ROOF AND THEN THE VENDOR WILL TAKE CARE OF THE REST. AND THAT'S EACH VENDOR WE'VE TALKED TO. THAT'S WHAT THEY TOLD US. AND THAT $50,000 IS DEPENDENT ON WHICH VENDOR WE GO WITH. YOU KNOW, OBVIOUSLY WE'RE NOT TO THE POINT TO GET RFPS YET, BUT THAT'S THE PRICE RANGE THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT. NO WORRIES. I RUN A NONPROFIT. I DEFINITELY UNDERSTAND THAT THAT THAT PART OF THE BID, HOW MANY PALLETS WOULD YOU ARE YOU LOOKING AT? I KNOW YOU SAID YOU'RE GOING TO ROLL OUT THE FIRST EIGHT. HOW MANY PALLETS PER DRONE OR HOW I MEAN, I KNOW IT'S GOING TO BE IN YOUR METRO SAFE. HOW DO YOU PLAN TO OPERATE THAT SINCE IT'S GOING TO BE 24 SEVEN, WE WOULD NEED FIVE PEOPLE TO STAFF THAT POSITION. 20 473 65. THAT'S OKAY. WE'RE LOOKING AT FIVE.

OKAY. ALL OF THIS SOUNDS GOOD. DRONES ARE ALREADY IN USE. THIS IS GOING TO GIVE YOU MORE CAPABILITY TO ADDRESS THINGS. HOPEFULLY, YOU KNOW LESS ACCIDENTS AND THINGS LIKE THAT.

AS IT IS. YOU KNOW, IT SHOULD BE LESS TRAFFIC RIGHT IN THE AIR. THE LAST MY LAST QUESTION IS ABOUT HOW WILL WE HOW WILL WE LET THE COMMUNITIES AND THE NEIGHBORHOOD FOLKS KNOW, LIKE

[00:40:01]

NOW WE THAT PROBABLY WAS NOT HAPPENING. BUT WHEN PEOPLE DON'T KNOW ABOUT TECHNOLOGY, THEY MAKE A LOT OF ASSUMPTIONS. SO I DON'T I SO WHAT IS YOUR THINKING AROUND THAT KIND OF SIGNAGE. SO PEOPLE KNOW THAT THERE'S A DRONE DFR AND USAGE IN THAT OR IN THAT AREA BESIDES OUR COMMUNITY MEETINGS. AND YOU'RE DEFINITELY INVITED TO ANY OF MINE. BUT YOU KNOW, WHAT ELSE ARE YOU THINKING ABOUT AS FAR AS AWARENESS WITH THE COMMUNITY? HONESTLY, WE'VE NOT GOTTEN TO THAT THAT POINT IN THE PROJECT YET, AND IT'S SOMETHING I'VE JUST WRITTEN IT DOWN FOR US TO CONSIDER MOVING FORWARD. OKAY. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. NO OTHER SPEAKERS IN THE QUEUE. DO ANY COMMITTEE MEMBERS HAVE ANY ADDITIONAL COMMENTS? NO. THANK YOU GUYS FOR SHOWING UP. WE LOOK FORWARD TO HEARING UPDATES ON THE ON THE PROGRAM. THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU ALL. CLERK. PLEASE READ NUMBER

[2. R-036-25     A RESOLUTION PURSUANT TO THE CAPITAL AND OPERATING BUDGET ORDINANCES APPROVING THE APPROPRIATION TO FUND THE FOLLOWING NONCOMPETITVELY NEGOTIATED PROFESSIONAL SERVICE CONTRACT FOR LOUISVILLE METRO POLICE DEPARTMENT (“LMPD”) CONCERNING A COORDINATOR FOR THE SEXUAL ASSUALT FORENSIC EXAMINER PROGRAM AND REQUIRING REPORTING THEREON AS HEREIN SET FORTH (UNIVERSITY MEDICAL CENTER, INC., D/B/A UNIVERSITY OF LOUISVILLE HOSPITAL/JAMES GRAHAM BROWN CANCER CENTER- $100,000.00). Action Required By: October 24, 2025 Sponsors: Dan Seum, Jr. (R-13) ]

SECOND, IT'S BEEN PROPERLY MOVED BY COMMITTEE MEMBERS. AS A SPONSOR OF THIS RESOLUTION, I'D LIKE TO TURN TO TURN THIS OVER TO JILL BATES TO DISCUSS THE SEXUAL ASSAULT NURSING EXAMINERS. SAME CONTRACT. JILL, PLEASE STATE YOUR NAME AND WHAT YOU DO. GOOD AFTERNOON. MY. MY NAME IS JILL BATES. AND I'M THE COMMANDER OF THE MAJOR CRIMES DIVISION WITH THE LOUISVILLE METRO POLICE DEPARTMENT. AND I'M HERE TO SUPPORT THE SAME PROGRAM. WHAT IT DOES IS FUNDING ALLOWS THE CONTINUED PARTNERSHIP WITH THE UNIVERSITY OF LOUISVILLE SANE PROGRAM, WHICH IS NECESSARY FOR ALL OUR SEXUAL ASSAULT VICTIMS IN 2024. 318 SEXUAL ASSAULT KITS WERE COLLECTED. 212 OF THOSE CASES WERE INVESTIGATED BY OUR SEX CRIMES UNIT, AND 106 OF THOSE WERE INVESTIGATED BY OUR DOMESTIC VIOLENCE UNIT. CURRENTLY, FOR 2025, WE HAVE HAD 120 SEXUAL SEXUAL ASSAULT EXAMINATIONS COMPLETED, 59 BEING COMPLETED BY OUR SEX CRIMES, BEING INVESTIGATED BY OUR SEX CRIMES UNIT AND 61 BY OUR DOMESTIC VIOLENCE UNIT. THE SAME PROGRAM IS THERE ARE EXPERTS. THEY PROVIDE US EVIDENCE WITH DNA. THEY TREAT THE SEXUAL ASSAULT VICTIMS, AND THEY ARE OUR EXPERT WITNESSES TO TESTIFY IN COURT REGARDING SEXUAL ASSAULTS. DO YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS? HEARING NONE. THIS RESOLUTION REQUIRES A ROLL CALL. VOTE. CLERK, PLEASE OPEN THE ROLL CALL. IT'S A RESOLUTION. BE A VOICE. VOICE VOTE THEN. ALL IN FAVOR, SAY AYE. AYE. ALL OPPOSED. RESOLUTION PASSES.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK YOU. CLERK. PLEASE READ ITEM NUMBER THREE IN THE RECORD, PLEASE. AN

[3. O-087-25     AN ORDINANCE AMENDING SECTIONS 123.01 THROUGH 123.06 AND SECTIONS 123.32, 123.35, AND 123.99 OF THE LOUISVILLE METRO CODE OF ORDINANCES (“LMCO”) REGARDING REGULATED PROPERTY AND RESTRICTED METALS. 4/16/25 Public Safety Committee Held Action Required By: September 27, 2025 Sponsors: Kevin Kramer (R-11) ]

[00:45:08]

[00:50:02]

SO THAT'S A PROBLEM. BUT BUT AT THE SAME TIME, THEY'RE CUTTING FIBER OPTIC CABLE, WHICH DOES THEM NO GOOD WHATSOEVER. AND YET IT PUTS WHOLE SEGMENTS OF OUR POPULATION WITHOUT ACCESS TO THE INTERNET UNTIL THEY CAN GET BACK IN AND FIX THAT. AND IT'S MUCH MORE EXPENSIVE TO REPAIR FIBER OPTIC CABLE WHEN IT'S BEEN CUT THAN IT IS TO REPAIR COPPER WHEN IT'S BEEN CUT. SO IT DEMANDS US DOING SOMETHING. SO THAT'S WHY WE'RE HERE TODAY. IT DEMANDS US DOING SOMETHING. WE'VE WE'VE GOT AN ORDINANCE HERE BEFORE US THAT I THINK MOVES US IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION. AND I WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE TAKING THIS SERIOUSLY AND MOVING THIS FORWARD. SO ALL OF THAT SAID, IF I COULD JUST GO THROUGH WHAT THE CHANGES TO THE ORDINANCE DO AND THEN I'LL HAPPILY ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS AND I'LL ASK THAT SOMEONE MAKE A MOTION TO AMEND. OKAY. SO HERE GOES. I'M IN SECTION ONE. WHAT IT DOES IS IT CHANGES THE DEPARTMENT OF SPECIALTY PERMITS AND LICENSES WITHIN LOUISVILLE METRO GOVERNMENT CHANGES THE DEFINITION OF WHO THAT DEPARTMENT IS BY NAME. IT CHANGES DEFINITIONS WITHIN THE ORDINANCE TO INCLUDE ELECTRIC OR HIGHWAY WIRING, TELECOMMUNICATIONS WIRE, AND OTHER INFRASTRUCTURE WIRING. IT.

IT ADDS INFRASTRUCTURE WIRING TO REGULATED PROPERTY. IT ADDRESSES THE FACT THAT SCRAP METALS OF ALL SORTS NEED TO BE CONSIDERED, NEED TO BE LOOKED AT IN TERMS OF REGULATED PROPERTY. WE JUST NEED TO FIGURE OUT WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE. WE CAN'T NAME EVERY SINGLE, EVERY SINGLE ITEM WE WANT TO REGULATE. THIS IS MY GOSH, BECAUSE WHEN WE DO THAT, WE'LL COME BACK IN A YEAR AND HAVE TO NAME NEW THINGS. WE HAVE TO FIND THE RIGHT LANGUAGE AROUND THAT. IT DOES REQUIRE LOCAL LICENSING, WHICH I THINK IS REALLY IMPORTANT RIGHT NOW. IF A IF A SCRAPYARD SCRAP DEALER IS NOT DOING WHAT WHAT WE REQUIRE THEM TO DO, WE CAN'T WITHDRAW THEIR LICENSE, IT'S THEY HAVE A STATE LICENSE. IF WE REQUIRE THEM TO HAVE A LOCAL LICENSE, THEN WE CAN WITHDRAW THEIR LICENSE IF THEY'RE NOT THREE, FOUR AND FIVE. TALK MORE ABOUT THE LICENSING AND THE APPLICATION PROCESS AND WHAT THAT WOULD REQUIRE. SECTION SIX AMENDS THE WAY THAT THAT TRANSACTIONS ARE RECORDED. SOME OF THOSE CHANGES WERE REQUESTED BY THE INDUSTRY. SECTION SEVEN AMENDS THE LIMITATIONS ON SALES. SECTION EIGHT ADDS LANGUAGE, WHICH I'M REALLY HAPPY ABOUT, THAT WILL ALLOW US TO IMPOUND THE VEHICLE OF CAR OF THE VEHICLES THAT ARE USED TO SELL THIS MATERIAL. SO IF SOMEBODY COMES TO THE IMPOUND TO THE SCRAPYARD AND THEY'RE SELLING AN ILLEGAL, IF THEY'RE SELLING SOMETHING THAT THEY'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO BE SELLING, THEY'RE NOT ALLOWED TO HAVE. AND WE'VE GOT A PICTURE OF THEM DOING IT. WE CAN THEN WE CAN IMPOUND THAT CAR, VERY MUCH LIKE WE DO WITH ILLEGAL DUMPING WHEN WE GOT A PICTURE OF SOMEBODY ILLEGALLY DUMPING. AND THAT HAS BEEN, BY THE WAY, INCREDIBLY EFFECTIVE AT SLOWING ILLEGAL DUMPING. SO IF WE CAN IF WE CAN YANK THE CAR OR TRUCK THAT THE PERSON'S USING TO SELL THIS STUFF ILLEGALLY, I THINK THAT SENDS A CLEAR MESSAGE. AND IT I THINK IT WILL SLOW US DOWN. SO I'M REALLY HAPPY THAT THAT WAS IN THERE. SECTION NINE CREATES A NEW A NEW OFFENSE VERY SIMILAR TO WHAT IT IS WITH CATALYTIC CONVERTERS. THERE'S NO REASON FOR A PERSON TO BE DRIVING AROUND WITH SEVEN CATALYTIC CONVERTERS IN THEIR CAR, RIGHT IN THE, IN THE BACK OF THEIR CAR. AND SO IF WE PULL SOMEBODY OVER AND THEY'VE GOT CATALYTIC CONVERTERS, THEY DON'T HAVE A REASON TO HAVE IT. THAT'S AGAINST THE LAW. WHAT WE JUST DID IN THIS ORDINANCE IS WE WROTE LANGUAGE IN THAT DOES THE SAME THING. IF SOMEBODY IS RIDING AROUND WITH A PICKUP TRUCK FULL OF TELECOMMUNICATIONS CABLE THAT THAT HAS HAD THE SHEATHING BURNT OFF OF IT, THERE'S NO REASON THAT SOMEBODY SHOULD HAVE THAT, RIGHT. THERE'S, THERE'S NOT A LEGAL WAY THAT YOU OWN THAT. SO IT WOULD HOLD THEM. IT WOULD ADD IT WOULD MAKE IT ILLEGAL THEN TO HAVE THAT IN YOUR POSSESSION. AND AGAIN, I THINK THAT WOULD GO A LONG WAY TO, TO BREAKING SOME OF THIS DOWN. SO THOSE ARE THE CHANGES. I'M GOING TO THROW IT OVER. ALLISON, I DON'T MEAN TO PUT YOU ON THE SPOT, BUT I'M GOING TO THROW IT OVER TO THE COUNTY ATTORNEY JUST BECAUSE VERY OFTEN WHEN I MOVE THROUGH THINGS, I THINK I'VE DONE A GREAT JOB. AND THE COUNTY ATTORNEY IS LIKE, YOU STATED THIS WRONG OR YOU MISSED THIS. SO WHATEVER. I MADE A MISTAKE ON ALICE. IF YOU'LL PLEASE FIX MY ERRORS. THIS IS ALICE. I'M WITH THE JEFFERSON COUNTY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE, AND I JUST HAVE ONE CORRECTION TO MAKE ON THE SECTION ABOUT IMPOUNDMENT. AT THE MOMENT, IT'S LIMITED TO VEHICLES THAT ARE USED TO REMOVE THE WIRING AND NOT AT THE SALE POINT. THANK YOU. I MISSTATED THAT IT'S AT THE. IT'S BECAUSE THE CONVERSATION IS THE COMPANIES HAVE A OBVIOUSLY THEY

[00:55:05]

THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. THANK YOU, COUNCILMAN. I HAVE COUNCILMAN KEN HERNDON, PLEASE. I SHOWED UP THIS TIME. GOOD QUESTION. YOU SAID ABOUT IF SOMEONE IS IN POSSESSION OF THE WIRE THAT THAT'S BEEN BURNED OFF THE POSSESSOR, WHAT ABOUT THE BUYER? SHOULD THEY NOT KNOW WHAT THAT IS AND WHERE IT CAME FROM AND NOT NOT IS THAT IS THAT THAT'S THAT'S WHAT MOST OF THIS ORDINANCE ACTUALLY DOES. MOST OF THIS ORDINANCE ACTUALLY REGULATES THE SCRAP DEALERS. SO IT SAYS IF YOU'RE GOING TO BUY THIS, THESE ARE THE CIRCUMSTANCES. THESE ARE THE KINDS OF THINGS YOU CAN BUY AND CAN'T BUY. AND WHEN YOU BUY THESE THINGS, THESE ARE THE THINGS THAT YOU HAVE TO KEEP TRACK OF. SO IF YOU IF YOU BUY SOMETHING FROM A PERSON WHO'S JUST BRINGING IT IN, YOU HAVE TO KEEP TRACK OF WHO IT WAS THAT BROUGHT IT IN, WHAT, WHAT THE VEHICLE'S LICENSE PLATE WAS. YOU HAVE TO GET INFORMATION FROM THEM, AND THEN YOU HAVE TO REPORT THAT TO US SO THAT IF WE KNOW THAT THAT'S STOLEN, WE CAN GO AFTER THE PERSON WHO TRIED TO SELL IT TO YOU. AND YOU CAN THEY COULD THEY SHOULD BE ABLE TO TELL WHEN THEY GET IT, WHERE IT CAME FROM BECAUSE OF THE CONDITION OR THE SHAPE. I MEAN, IS THAT IS THAT THAT'S THE PREMISE? YEAH. THE IDEA IS THAT, YOU KNOW, TELECOMMUNICATIONS CABLE IS FAIRLY IDENTIFIABLE.

THE PROBLEM IS THAT ONCE YOU BURN THE SHEATHING OFF OF THAT TELECOMMUNICATIONS CABLE, YOU CAN'T KNOW WHERE IT CAME FROM. SO YOU CAN'T KNOW WHOSE IT WAS. SO YOU CAN'T SAY, YOU KNOW, YOU STOLE THIS FROM CHARTER, FOR EXAMPLE, BECAUSE THE SHEATHING IS WHERE THAT WAS IDENTIFIED.

YOU CAN CERTAINLY STILL TELL THAT THIS IS BURNT CABLE, AND YOU CAN TELL THAT THEY BURNT THE SHEATHING OFF, BUT THAT'S PROBABLY A LITTLE BIT VAGUE THAT IT WOULDN'T. OKAY. YEAH. THANK YOU. COUNCILWOMAN SHAMIKA PARISH. RIGHT. PLEASE. THANK YOU. I JUST WANTED TO KNOW, I HEARD YOU SAY YOU TALKED TO SEVERAL PEOPLE. IF YOU TALK TO PEOPLE IN THE INDUSTRY AND KIND OF WHAT COUNCILMAN PIAGENTINI SAID, IF I. I DON'T KNOW NOBODY WHO RIDES AROUND WITH CATALYTIC CONVERTERS. AND SO THERE'S OBVIOUS SIGNS. I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT THE GOOD PEOPLE THAT ARE DOING THAT KIND OF SIMILAR WORK, BECAUSE I'VE SEEN PEOPLE CALL FOR DEMOS TO THEIR HOUSES AND THINGS LIKE THAT, AND THEY GIVE SCRAP AND THINGS AWAY TO PEOPLE. I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE AND IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU COVERED IT. THERE'S SOME SAFEGUARDS IN FOR PEOPLE WHO ACTUALLY DO DO THAT FOR A WAY OF EARNING A LIVING, BUT THEY'RE DOING IT THE RIGHT WAY, AND I DIDN'T I AND NOT TO SAY YOU DIDN'T MENTION IT, I JUST WANTED TO HEAR, HEAR THAT, IF I MAY. I

[01:00:02]

COUNCILWOMAN. THE I WOULD POINT OUT AGAIN THE PRIMARY REASON THAT WE'RE THAT THIS IS BEFORE US TODAY IS BECAUSE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT TELECOMMUNICATIONS, CABLE AND WIRING FROM STREET LIGHTS LIKE THE KYTC OWNED STREET LIGHTS. SO THOSE ARE NOT THE KINDS OF WIRES THAT A PERSON WHO'S DOING A LEGITIMATE BUSINESS WOULD COME INTO CONTACT WITH. THERE'S NOT A THERE. YOU WOULDN'T HAVE A PERSON WHO'S GOING OUT AND PULLING THESE WIRES OFF OF OR OUT OF CONDUIT AND THEN SELLING IT AS SCRAP. THAT THAT WOULDN'T BE A NORMAL, A NORMAL THING TO DO. NOW, IF THERE IS A SECTION OF CABLE THAT THAT SAY, AT&T WAS REMOVING, THEN THERE IS A LANGUAGE IN THE ORDINANCE THAT PROVIDES THAT IF THE PERSON WHO WHO HAD THE CABLE AND WAS USING IT, IF THEY INTENDED FOR IT TO BE SOLD, THEN THERE IS A PROVISION IN THERE THAT ALLOWS FOR EITHER THE OWNER OR WITH DOCUMENTATION, SOMEBODY WHO HAS THAT WIRE TO BE ABLE TO SELL IT.

SO IF YOU HIRED A COMPANY TO COME IN, REMOVE WIRE FROM A FROM A COUPLE POLES WHERE A NEW NEIGHBORHOOD IS BEING BUILT, THEY WOULD HAVE THE DOCUMENTATION THEY WOULD NEED IN ORDER TO BE ABLE TO SELL THAT. SO THAT WOULD NOT BE A PROBLEM AS FAR AS TAKING THINGS FROM LIKE REMODELING IN A HOUSE THERE, THAT THOSE MATERIALS ARE STILL SELLABLE. IT DOESN'T PROHIBIT THEIR BEING PURCHASED. WHAT IT DOES IS IT REQUIRES THAT THE PERSON WHO'S BRINGING THEM IN FOR SALE CAN DEMONSTRATE THAT THERE IS A REASON FOR THEM TO HAVE THOSE ITEMS. SO TO YOUR POINT, IF I'M HAVING A MAJOR REMODEL DONE IN MY HOME, THE COMPANY WHO TOOK THAT, THAT COPPER TUBING OUT OF MY HOUSE, THEY'VE HAD THEY'VE GOT A GOOD REASON TO DO THAT. THEY CAN SHOW WHERE THEY WERE REMODELING MY HOUSE. THEY'VE GOT, YOU KNOW, THE DOCUMENTS THAT PROVE THAT THEY'RE DOING WORK FOR ME VERSUS SOMEONE WHO SHOWS UP WITH THE SAME QUANTITY OF COPPER TUBING, BUT NO EXPLANATION FOR WHERE IT CAME FROM, EXCEPT TO SAY I WAS REMODELING A HOUSE SOMEWHERE.

WHO'S HOUSE WERE YOU REMODELING? WHO OWNED IT? WHO OWNED THE COPPER THAT'S IN YOUR TRUCK RIGHT NOW? IF YOU CAN'T ANSWER THOSE QUESTIONS, THEN. ONE HAS TO WONDER WHERE YOU GOT THAT.

AND THAT'S WHAT THIS ORDINANCE DOES. IT REQUIRES THE SCRAP METAL PURCHASERS TO KEEP TRACK OF THAT INFORMATION, SO THAT OUR POLICE CAN GO BACK AND SAY, WHERE'D YOU GET THAT METAL THAT YOU SOLD? THANK YOU. FAIR ENOUGH. I, I'M NOT AN EXPERT IN THIS AREA AND I JUST WANTED TO THINK ABOUT THAT. SO THANK YOU. AND YOU ANSWERED IT PERFECTLY. THANK YOU. I DON'T SEE ANY MORE SPEAKERS IN THE QUEUE. DO ANY COMMITTEE MEMBERS HAVE ANY MORE ADDITIONAL COMMENTS? WE DO.

YEAH. THERE HAVE BEEN SEVERAL QUESTIONS RAISED ABOUT THE INCONSISTENCIES BETWEEN STATE LAW AND SOME OF THE DEFINITIONS. I WOULD LIKE TO HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO WORK WITH COUNCILMAN KRAMER TO GET TO A YES VOTE. I WANT TO MAKE A MOTION TO TABLE THIS, TO TABLE IT. YOU WANT TO TABLE IT, YOU WANT TO VOTE ON IT. THIS IS WHAT HE NEEDS A SECOND. IF YOU REALLY WANT TO TABLE, I. I DON'T HAVE ANY HEARTBURN TABLING IT. IF YOU KNOW IF THERE ARE COUNCIL MEMBERS WHO HAVE QUESTIONS OR ISSUES, DO WE HAVE ANY MEMBERS WHO HAVE ANY QUESTIONS? J.J. WE HAVE WE HAVE NO MORE IN THE QUEUE. THIS ORDINANCE REQUIRES A ROLL CALL. VOTE CLERK. I CAN I CAN MAKE A SECOND TO TABLE THAT. JJ SECOND YOU WANT TO TABLE IT. YES. OH YOU DO OKAY. ARE WE GETTING A SECOND THEN I'LL SECOND THAT. OKAY. THE MOTION HAS BEEN SECONDED. SO THE ITEM HAS BEEN TABLED. YOU NEED A VOTE. ITEM OKAY. I NEED A VOICE VOTE TO TABLE THE ITEM. ALL IN FAVOR, SAY AYE. ALL AGAINST. THANK YOU, THANK YOU. COLLEAGUES, I WILL WORK WITH JJ AND ANYBODY ELSE WHO HAS ANY QUESTIONS OR CONCERNS. AND WE'LL GET THIS RIGHT. AND WE'LL BE

[01:05:03]

[Adjournment Note: Agendas are followed at the discretion of the Chair. While an item may be listed, it does not mean all items will be heard and/or acted upon by the Committee.]