[00:00:04]
          IT SEEMS TO ME. GOOD AFTERNOON. I'M COUNCILMAN KEVIN CRAMER. THIS IS THE, BUDGET COMMITTEE, 
          [Call to Order]
IT IS JULY 18TH AT 435. SO WE'RE JUST A FEW MINUTES LATE GETTING STARTED, BUT I WANT TO GO AHEAD 
          [Roll Call]
AND GET GOING. JOINING ME IN COUNCIL CHAMBERS IS COUNCILMAN ARTHUR, COUNCILMAN PIAGENTINI, COUNCILMAN HUDSON AND COUNCILWOMAN FOWLER, JOINING ME VIRTUALLY IS COUNCILMAN, COUNCILWOMAN MCCRANEY. COUNCILWOMAN PARKER AND COUNCILMAN OWEN, I HAVE EXCUSED ABSENCES FOR COUNCILMAN BLACKWELL. HE WAS CONJOINED VIRTUALLY, BUT, SOMETHING HAS COME UP. HE'S NOT GOING TO BE ABLE TO JOIN US, COUNCILWOMAN PARISH. RIGHT. AND COUNCILWOMAN RENO WEBER ALSO HAVE EXCUSED ABSENCES, WE HAVE A COUPLE ITEMS ON THE AGENDA TODAY. BUT BEFORE I GET STARTED, I'M GOING TO ASK IF THE CLERK WOULD READ INTO THE RECORD THE STATEMENT ABOUT VIRTUAL MEETINGS. THIS MEETING IS BEING HELD PURSUANT TO CRS 61.826 AND COUNCIL RULE FIVE EIGHT REGARDING FULL. OKAY. WE HAVE, TWO ITEMS ON THE AGENDA TODAY. LET'S SEE. I'M TAKING CARE OF ROLL CALL. GET OUT OF THIS MEETING. GET THE RIGHT ONE. OKAY, SO YOU HAVE TWO ITEMS ON 
          [1.
 O-135-24     AN ORDINANCE AMENDING ORDINANCE NO. 201, SERIES 2022, RELATING TO THE AMERICAN RESCUE PLAN (ARP) LOCAL FISCAL RECOVERY FUNDING TO VARIOUS LOUISVILLE METRO GOVERNMENT DEPARTMENTS TO ADDRESS THE CONTINUED IMPACT OF COVID-19 ON THE ECONOMY, PUBLIC HEALTH, STATE AND LOCAL GOVERNMENTS, INDIVIDUALS, AND BUSINESSES BY AMENDING LANGUAGE PERTAINING TO THE RESIDENTIAL SERVICES FOR SUBSTANCE ABUSE AND ADDICTION PROJECT (LAT-0004).
Action Required By: December 2024
Sponsors: Jecorey Arthur (I-4) ]
THE AGENDA TODAY. THE FIRST ONE IS, ORDINANCE ONE 3524. IT IS AN ORDINANCE AMENDING ORDINANCE NUMBER 21, SERIES 2022, RELATING TO THE AMERICAN RESCUE PLAN, LOCAL FISCAL RECOVERY FUNDING TO VARIOUS LOUISVILLE METRO GOVERNMENT DEPARTMENTS TO ADDRESS THE CONTINUED IMPACT OF COVID 19 ON THE ECONOMY, PUBLIC HEALTH, STATE AND LOCAL GOVERNMENTS, INDIVIDUALS, AND BUSINESSES BY AMENDING LANGUAGE PERTAINING TO THE PRESIDENTIAL TO THE RESIDENTIAL SERVICES FOR SUBSTANCE ABUSE AND ADDICTION PROJECT. SECOND. OKAY, IT'S PROPERLY BEFORE US, HERE TO SPEAK TO THIS TODAY, ARE KEN HILDEBRAND AND JOSH SWETNAM, MR. HILDEBRAND, IF YOU'D LIKE TO TAKE THE FLOOR. THANK YOU. KEN HILDEBRAND, DIRECTOR OF THE LOUISVILLE ACCELERATOR TEAM, WHICH IS PART OF THE OFFICE OF MANAGEMENT AND BUDGET. SO THIS ITEM THAT WE HAVE BEFORE YOU IS AN AMENDMENT TO THE SCOPE OF THE LANGUAGE FOR THE RESIDENTIAL SERVICES FOR SUBSTANCE ABUSE AND ADDICTION PROJECT THAT THE COUNCIL APPROVED PREVIOUSLY. THERE'S NO BUDGET IMPACTS TO THIS, THIS AMENDMENT THAT WE'RE ASKING FOR OR WE'RE LOOKING TO DO IS ADD LANGUAGE THAT SAYS INCLUDING LANDLORD INCENTIVES FOR PERSONS WITH DISABILITIES, INCLUDING SUBSTANCE ABUSE AND ADDICTION. SO I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY ARP MECHANICAL QUESTIONS ABOUT THE AMENDMENT. 
          BUT I ALSO HAVE JOSH SWETNAM FROM THE DIRECTOR OF, RESILIENCE AND COMMUNITY SERVICES AND JOE HAMILTON FROM RESILIENCE AND COMMUNITY SERVICE TO ANSWER ANY PROGRAMMATIC QUESTIONS. SO I'LL START AND THEN I'LL TURN IT OVER TO MY COLLEAGUES. THE LANGUAGE, SAYS, TO INCLUDE FINANCIAL INCENTIVES FOR LANDLORDS TAKING PERSONS WITH DISABILITIES, INCLUDING SUBSTANCE ABUSE AND ADDICTION. YES, CAN YOU SPEAK TO WHAT THAT WOULD DO PRACTICALLY IN THE DAY TO DAY? WHAT'S THAT GOING TO LOOK LIKE? WHAT'S THAT ACTUALLY GOING TO DO? WELL, I THINK JOSH AND JOE CAN ANSWER THAT QUESTION. YES, I'D HAVE THEM START THERE AND THEN AGAIN. OKAY. WE'LL GO FROM THERE. THANK YOU. AND THIS IS JOSH OR JOE. SO JOSH SWETNAM. YEAH. IF YOU'LL JUST INTRODUCE YOURSELF. GOOD AFTERNOON. JOSH SWETNAM CO-DIRECTOR OF RESILIENCE AND COMMUNITY SERVICES. GREAT, TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION, IN THE DAY TO DAY, SO RESILIENCE COMMUNITY SERVICES HAS A HOUSING SUPPORT TEAM AND WE HAVE MULTIPLE HUD GRANTS WHERE WE ARE WORKING WITH INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE FORMERLY UNHOUSED AND HAVE PERMANENT SUPPORTIVE, SUPPORTIVE HOUSING VOUCHERS, SO WE HAVE A WHOLE TEAM, ONE TEAM THAT WORKS WITH LANDLORDS. AND MANAGES, LEASES AND PARTNERSHIPS WITH LANDLORDS TO HELP FIND AND SECURE HOUSING FOR FOLKS WHO ARE FORMERLY UNHOUSED. THE OTHER HALF OF OUR TEAM, UNDER THE LEADERSHIP OF JOE HAMILTON, PROVIDE CASE MANAGEMENT SUPPORT OF SERVICES TO ALL OF OUR CLIENTS. AND I THINK WE'VE GOT BETWEEN 4 AND 5, 500 HOUSEHOLDS THAT WE'RE SERVING IN THAT PROGRAM INTO RCS RIGHT NOW, ALL OF OUR PARTICIPANTS HAVE A DIAGNOSIS RELATED TO EITHER MENTAL HEALTH, SUBSTANCE ABUSE, OR BOTH. WE KNOW THAT THESE INDIVIDUALS ARE SOME OF THE THEY HAVE SOME OF THE GREATEST CHALLENGES WHEN IT COMES TO, GETTING OFF THE STREETS AND SECURING PERMANENT HOUSING. SO, THIS PROGRAM WOULD JUST FURTHER, INCENTIVIZE LANDLORDS TO WORK WITH THE INDIVIDUALS THAT WE SERVE, INDIVIDUALS WHO MAY OTHERWISE HAVE SOME CHALLENGES SECURING HOUSING IN THE COMMUNITY. AND I THINK ONE OF THE THINGS THAT HELPS IS KNOWING THAT THEY'VE GOT THE SUPPORT OF A TEAM LIKE, JOE'S TEAM AT RCS THAT CAN, 
          [00:05:06]
SUPPORT, SUPERVISE, SUPPORT THE TENANTS, PROVIDE SERVICES, AND ALSO MAINTAIN A CONNECTION WITH THE LANDLORD SO WE CAN TROUBLESHOOT ANY ISSUES AS THEY ARISE. SO WHAT DOES FINANCIAL INCENTIVES FOR LANDLORDS TAKING PERSONS WITH DISABILITIES OR WHAT ARE WE TALKING ABOUT HERE? WELL, SO WE, FIRST OF ALL, THERE IS A SHORTAGE OF AFFORDABLE HOUSING FOR THIS POPULATION IN THE COMMUNITY, SO THAT'S A CHALLENGE, BUT ALSO, WE KNOW THAT THERE IS AT TIMES A STIGMA ASSOCIATED WITH WORKING WITH OUR CLIENTS, OUR POPULATION, BECAUSE OF THE MARKET AND BECAUSE OF JUST THE STATE OF HOUSING IN OUR COMMUNITY, OFTENTIMES LANDLORDS MAY CHOOSE OR MAY BE RELUCTANT TO WORK WITH OUR TEAM, AND IN PARTICULAR TO RENT TO INDIVIDUALS WITH THESE DISABILITIES. SO WE BELIEVE THAT HAVING A PILOT WHERE WE CAN PROVIDE SOME FINANCIAL INCENTIVES FOR ONE, RENTING TO OUR CLIENTS AND ALSO KEEPING THOSE TENANTS IN HOUSING FOR A YEAR OR MORE, IS GOING TO JUST INCREASE THE, THE LIKELIHOOD THAT THEY'LL BE HOUSED. WE CURRENTLY HAVE A WAITING LIST. AND I MAY HAVE JOE HAMILTON COME UP AND SPEAK TO THAT, BUT BUT HE CAN SPEAK TO THE NEED. WE'RE HOPING THAT THIS PROGRAM WILL HELP ALLEVIATE SOME OF THAT. 
          THAT NEED BY ENCOURAGING MORE LANDLORDS TO RENT TO OUR TENANT. AND AGAIN, IF YOU'LL INTRODUCE YOURSELF FOR THE RECORD. GOOD AFTERNOON, JOE HAMILTON, MANAGER FOR THE HOUSING AND SUPPORT DIVISION AT LOUISVILLE METRO RESILIENCE AND COMMUNITY SERVICES, YOU KNOW, THE WAY IT WORKS. WE'RE A CONTINUUM OF CARE FUNDING. SO WE FOLLOW THE SAME COORDINATED ENTRY PROCESS FOR ANYBODY THAT'S HOMELESS IN THE CITY, GETS ON A WAITING LIST AT THE COALITION FOR THE HOMELESS AND WHEN WE HAVE AN OPENING, WE CONTACT THEM AND THEY COME TO US FOR INTAKE. AND THEN THE SEARCH FOR AN AVAILABLE APARTMENT TO RENT. WHAT'S HAPPENING? AND IT HAS BEEN HAPPENING SINCE COVID, IS THAT THAT SEARCH PERIOD IS TAKING ASTRONOMICALLY LONGER. AND IT'S A COMBINATION OF RENTAL MARKET FACTORS, AND THEN JUST QUITE FRANKLY, THE EXISTING POOL OF LANDLORDS THAT WE HAD IN THE CITY, A LOT OF THEM HAVE BEEN BOUGHT OUT BY OUTSIDE, OUTSIDE THE CITY, COMPANIES, THEY'VE BEEN CONSOLIDATED. SO THE LARGEST LANDLORD WE USE FOR YEARS, DISBANDED DURING COVID. 
          AND WE HAVE FOLKS JUST WAITING, WE'RE WE'RE PROVIDING HOUSING, NAVIGATION. WE'RE PROVIDING SUPPORTIVE SERVICES WHILE THEY'RE WAITING. BUT WE HAVE PEOPLE RIGHT NOW WITH A VOUCHER. 
          SLEEPING, SLEEPING OUT AT THE CAMPS BECAUSE WE CAN'T FIND A UNIT FOR THEM. WE CAN'T FIND A FAIR, YOU KNOW, A UNIT THAT MEETS HEALTH AND SAFETY AND OTHER CITIES DURING COVID HAVE HAD SIMILAR INCENTIVE PROGRAMS TO RECRUIT AND THEN RETAIN NEW PROPERTY OWNERS AND LANDLORDS THAT ARE REPUTABLE. AND THAT'S WHAT WE DESPERATELY NEED. SO THIS IS REALLY A UNIQUE CHANCE, HOPEFULLY, TO INCREASE OUR SUPPLY, BECAUSE WE HAVE THE DEMAND THERE WAITING. COUNCILMAN ARTHUR. THANK YOU. IT DOESN'T SAY THIS, AND I MIGHT BE GUESSING AND PUTTING WORDS IN YOUR MOUTHS, BUT I WANT TO POINT TO A DOCUMENT WE WERE SENT FROM KEN HILDEBRAND ABOUT AN INTERAGENCY AGREEMENT WITH PUBLIC HEALTH AND WELLNESS IN YOUR OFFICE. SO WHEN WE TALK ABOUT THESE INCENTIVES OF COURSE, THE INCENTIVES AND WORKING WITH THE LANDLORD IS ONE PIECE OF THIS. BUT BECAUSE YOU HAVE THAT AGREEMENT WITH ANOTHER AGENCY, SPECIFICALLY PUBLIC HEALTH AND WELLNESS, IS IT ALSO TRUE THAT YOU'RE ALSO PROVIDING WRAPAROUND SERVICES FOR THE CLIENTS AND MAKING SURE THAT THEY GET TREATMENT AS THEY ENDURE HOUSING? RIGHT. SO ANY INCENTIVE WILL GO TO EXISTING CLIENTS, MEANING THAT THEY HAVE A VOUCHER THROUGH OUR DEPARTMENT. SO WE'RE PAYING UP TO THE FAIR MARKET RENT, AND IT'S OF COURSE INCOME BASED. 
          RIGHT SO THE CLIENT OR THE TENANT PAYS 30% OF WHATEVER INCOME THEY HAVE. AND WE'RE THERE WITH THE VOUCHER TO PAY THE REST, MUCH LIKE HOUSING CHOICE VOUCHER. LOUISVILLE METRO HOUSING AUTHORITY SECTION EIGHT. SO ALL OUR EXISTING CLIENTS WITHIN OUR DEPARTMENT, WE HAVE THE EXPERTISE FOR THAT. AND HENCE WHY THE, YOU KNOW, ESSENTIALLY PASS THROUGH FROM PUBLIC HEALTH AND WELLNESS TO US, AS YOU KNOW, THE EXPERTS IN THIS IN THIS FIELD. JUST TO CLARIFY WHAT I HEARD, WHAT I HEARD IS THE RESPONSE WAS, I DON'T THINK WAS YOUR I DON'T THINK HE CHARACTERIZED IT QUITE THE SAME WAY. OKAY. I'M SORRY, NO, NO, IT'S FINE AS I READ IT AND AS I UNDERSTAND, THE MONEY IS HOUSED RIGHT NOW IN PUBLIC HEALTH AND WELLNESS. AND IN ORDER TO USE THE MONEY THAT'S HOUSED IN PUBLIC HEALTH AND WELLNESS TO DO THIS INCENTIVE 
          [00:10:04]
PROGRAM, THE FOLKS WHO ACTUALLY WOULD BE RUNNING THE INCENTIVE PROGRAM ARE IN OUR, IN SUSTAINABLE OR IN, RCS. THANK YOU, RCS. SO IT'S NOT THAT HEALTH AND WELLNESS IS TAKING A CLIENT OF THEIRS. AND THEN CONTINUING WITH THAT CLIENT IS THAT HEALTH AND WELLNESS HAS THIS POT OF MONEY. THEY'RE TURNING THAT POT OF MONEY OVER RCS. BUT WHAT I'M TRYING TO SO YOU WANT TO FOLLOW UP THEN? I'M JUST TRYING TO CLARIFY THE CLIENTS ARE RECEIVING WRAPAROUND SERVICES, INCLUDING TREATMENT. THAT'S THAT'S WHAT I'M TRYING TO MAKE SURE IS CLEAR FOR EVERYONE. 
          YOU'RE NOT JUST GIVING LANDLORDS MONEY AND SAYING, DEAL WITH THIS PERSON WHO HAS A SUBSTANCE USE ISSUE OR AN ADDICTION ISSUE. YOU'RE ACTUALLY PROVIDING TREATMENT AND WRAPAROUND SERVICES IN ADDITION TO THE HOUSING. ABSOLUTELY. COUNCILMAN SO OUR TEAM, THEY CONDUCT AN ASSESSMENT, WHEN WE INITIATE SERVICES, THERE'S A PROCESS OF SETTING GOALS. AND THEN THOSE GOALS ARE TAILORED TO WHAT THAT PERSON NEEDS. OBVIOUSLY, HOUSING IS THEIR PRIMARY NEED, AND THAT'S THE ESSENCE OF THE PROGRAM AT RCS. BUT WE KNOW THAT TO MAKE PROGRESS AND MAINTAIN HOUSING AND MAINTAIN SAFETY, THEY NEED WRAPAROUND SERVICES. AND SO IF SOMEONE IS STRUGGLING WITH ADDICTION, WE'RE GOING TO CONNECT THEM WITH SERVICES TO TREAT THAT ADDICTION. IF THEY NEED MENTAL HEALTH CARE, WE'RE GOING TO CONNECT THEM WITH A MENTAL HEALTH PROVIDER, IF THEY NEED EMPLOYMENT, WE HELP CONNECT THEM WITH JOB RESOURCES, EDUCATION, VOCATIONAL TRAINING, REALLY WHATEVER THEY NEED, IT'S A MATTER OF TAILORING IT TO WHAT THEIR UNIQUE NEEDS ARE. BUT THE GOAL IS TO HELP THEM STABILIZE AND MOVE FORWARD INTO GREATER STABILITY OVER TIME. AND ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I KNOW WE'RE PROUD OF WITH THE TEAM AT RCS IS A VERY LOW EVICTION RATE WITH FOLKS WHO ARE IN OUR PROGRAM FOR AN EXTENDED PERIOD OF TIME, SO WE'VE SHOWN THAT THOSE WRAPAROUND SERVICES DO HELP STABILIZE THE FOLKS WHO COME INTO OUR PROGRAM. THANK YOU. SO MUCH. THANK YOU, COUNCILMAN HUDSON. THANK YOU. CHAIR, COULD YOU DESCRIBE FOR ME WHAT THE CONTROL LOOP LOOKS LIKE TO KNOW, IF YOU'RE IF YOU'RE SUCCEEDING WITH THE MONEY THAT'S BEING GIVEN, WHAT METRICS YOU'RE MEASURING, THOSE KINDS OF THINGS. SO THIS IS THIS IS SOMETHING THAT'S, YOU KNOW, AT THE VERY, FRONT END, THE BEGINNING STAGES, AS A PILOT. 
          BUT WE KNOW THAT TWO OF THE MAIN OUTCOMES THAT WE'RE GOING TO BE TRACKING ARE GOING TO BE ONE, BECAUSE WE ARE SERVING INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE CURRENTLY IN OUR PROGRAM BY WAY OF HAVING A HOUSING VOUCHER. THEY JUST DON'T HAVE HOUSING BECAUSE OF THE SHORTAGE OF SUPPLY. AND SO, REALLY, HOW MANY OF THOSE INDIVIDUALS AND WE ANTICIPATE 175, THAT'S OUR ESTIMATE, IF WE ARE ABLE TO USE THESE INCENTIVES, THESE DOLLARS, BUT HOW MANY MORE PEOPLE DO WE ACTUALLY GET HOUSED AND SAFE, STABLE HOUSING, IN A UNIT VERSUS WHAT WE'VE SEEN, IN OUR CURRENT ITERATION, SO, SO ONE OUTCOME IS WHAT'S THE SUM TOTAL OF ADDITIONAL PEOPLE HOUSED, WHO ARE ELIGIBLE, THE SECOND IS THE NET GAIN IN PARTNERSHIPS. SO RIGHT NOW WE HAVE, A CERTAIN NUMBER OF LANDLORDS THAT WILL WORK WITH US AND WILL SERVE OUR POPULATION. WE WANT TO SEE A SIGNIFICANT NET GAIN IN THE NUMBER OF LANDLORDS THAT WILL WORK WITH US OR PROPERTY OWNERS THAT WILL WORK WITH US, AND I THINK WE CAN MEASURE THAT MENTIONING CONTROL GROUP. I THINK WE CAN MEASURE THAT TO, JUST THE NEED OF THE UNHOUSED OVERALL. I MEAN, THEIR STATISTICS FROM COALITION, FROM HOMELESS AND OUR OTHER PARTNERS ABOUT HOW MANY FOLKS ARE ON THAT WAITING LIST. SO IF WE CAN LOOK AT OUR POPULATION AND THE GAINS WE MAKE, I THINK THAT WILL GIVE US AN IDEA OF THE SUCCESS OF THE PILOT. OKAY. AND WHAT'S THE FREQUENCY THAT YOU PULSE, THAT CONTROL LOOP? I'M SORRY. REPEAT THAT AGAIN, PLEASE. WHAT IS THE FREQUENCY AT WHICH YOU PULSE YOUR CONTROL LOOP, WELL, I MAY HAVE JOE CAN SPEAK TO THIS, BUT I KNOW THAT, ONE ANSWER TO THAT IS, IS ALMOST CONSTANTLY BECAUSE WE ARE A MEMBER OF THE CAC. THE CONTINUUM OF CARE, THOSE MEETINGS OCCUR MONTHLY. WE'RE ALSO IN CONSTANT COMMUNICATION WITH THE COALITION FOR THE HOMELESS, AND THERE'S DATA THAT'S COMING OUT MONTHLY AND QUARTERLY FROM THEM. SO, SO WE HAVE ANECDOTAL EVIDENCE FROM JUST ALMOST DAILY COMMUNICATION WITH OUR PARTNERS AS WELL AS MORE FORMAL, METRICS THAT ARE THAT ARE PUBLISHED BY COALITION FOR THE HOMELESS AND THE CONTINUUM OF CARE. SO WE'D BE ABLE TO KIND OF BENCHMARK AGAINST WHAT WE'RE SEEING IN THE COMMUNITY AS, AS A WHOLE. OKAY. AND THIS THIS IS MY LAST QUESTION, CHAIR. SO WITH WITH THE NUMBERS, YOU JUST GAVE 175 PEOPLE. IT WORKS OUT TO ABOUT $5,000 PER PERSON. IS THERE EVIDENCE TO SHOW THAT THAT IS ENOUGH INCENTIVE OR TOO MUCH INCENTIVE FOR LANDLORD TO BE 
          [00:15:02]
EFFECTIVE, DO YOU MIND FEELING THAT? I KNOW THAT JOE HAS DONE SOME RESEARCH ON WHAT'S BEEN EFFECTIVE IN OTHER COMMUNITIES, SO I'LL I'LL LET JOE TAKE THAT ONE. OKAY YEAH. THE INCENTIVE IS GOING TO THE PROPERTY OWNER. THE LANDLORD. IT'S RECRUITING MORE HOUSING SUPPLY. RIGHT SO THAT WE CAN GET PEOPLE HOUSED SO THAT THEY CAN THEN WORK ON EVERYTHING ELSE, WHETHER THAT'S MENTAL HEALTH. YOU KNOW, IT'S REALLY HARD TO WORK ON MENTAL HEALTH OR SUBSTANCE ABUSE WHEN YOU'RE ON THE STREETS OR IN THE CAMPS. SO THAT HAVING THAT ROOF IS A CRUCIAL FIRST STEP, AND WANTED TO CIRCLE BACK A LITTLE BIT MORE ON WHAT YOUR SECOND QUESTION WAS. SO WE HAVE TWO MAIN DATABASES WHERE WE TRACK. SO OUR CASTANET SYSTEM IS WHERE WE MAKE ALL OF OUR LANDLORD PAYMENTS. 
          WHEN WE ADD A NEW VENDOR, OBVIOUSLY THAT'S FLAGGED. AND WE'LL BE ABLE TO MEASURE THAT IN REAL TIME, I WOULD LIKE TO I'LL PROBABLY SET UP QUARTERLY METRICS FOR THIS, AND IT OF COURSE, WITH KEN, WITH THE ACCELERATED TEAM, THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE VARIOUS METRICS TOO. SO, AND THEN WE ALSO TRACK ALL THE CLIENT LEVEL DATA IN THE HOMELESS MANAGEMENT INFORMATION SYSTEM. SO ALL THE HOMELESS PROVIDERS IN THE CITY ARE USING HMMIS TO TRACK OUTCOMES, I CAN TELL YOU WE HAVE, WELL OVER 93% OF OUR CLIENTS THAT COME IN AS DISABLED AND HOUSELESS. AFTER 12 MONTHS, THEY'RE STILL IN HOUSING. AND SO THAT'S A TESTAMENT TO OUR WRAPAROUND SUPPORTS THAT MY TEAM PROVIDES. OKAY. IS THERE ANYONE ELSE IN THE QUEUE? YES. OKAY. I'LL COME BACK THEN. COUNCILWOMAN FOWLER, YES. IF I COULD ASK YOU, YOU MENTIONED HMAS AND YOU KNOW, THE CITY GOVERNMENT HAS ACCESS TO THAT, EXCEPT FOR LMPD. WE DON'T LET THEM HAVE THAT. AND I DON'T KNOW WHOSE CALL THAT IS, BUT YOU KNOW, THEY CALL MEDICINE FOR THE HOMELESS. THE COALITION FOR THE HOMELESS. THEY, THEY HAVE THE LICENSE BECAUSE IT'S, IT'S REAL IMPORTANT FOR THEM TO BE ABLE TO KEEP TRACK OF THE PEOPLE THAT, YOU KNOW, THEY HAVE REACHED OUT TO FOR SERVICES. AND IT'S BEEN A BIG ISSUE. YOU KNOW, I WAS ABLE TO, GET FUNDING FOR THAT IN LAST YEAR'S BUDGET. AND IT THE DATA SYSTEM NEVER GOT SET UP. THAT WAS SUPPOSED TO HAVE. BUT ANYWAY, MY QUESTION KIND OF FOLLOWED, COUNCILMAN ARTHURS ON, THE WRAPAROUND SERVICES. IS THAT MANDATED OR IS THAT VOLUNTARY? WELL, THAT'S A THAT'S A REALLY, REALLY GOOD QUESTION. TECHNICALLY, IT'S MANDATED THROUGH HUD. SO IF AS WE ARE THE RECIPIENT OF PERMANENT SUPPORTIVE HOUSING GRANTS, EVERY CLIENT ASSISTED THROUGH HOUSING IS REQUIRED TO HAVE AN ANNUAL SERVICE PLAN. AND THAT'S WHAT WHAT JOSH MENTIONED EARLIER, WHICH IS INDIVIDUALIZED AND TAILORED TO THE INDIVIDUAL NEEDS. SO THE HOUSEHOLD, TECHNICALLY, SINCE WE'RE OPERATING IN A HOUSING FIRST PHILOSOPHY, YOU CAN A CLIENT COULD OPT OUT ON A LOT OF THE SERVICES, BUT WE STILL HAVE TO SHOW UP. WE STILL DO HOME VISIT. WE'RE STILL LAYING EYES ON THE UNIT THROUGHOUT THE LEASE TERM, WHICH IS ALWAYS 12 MONTHS. BUT TECHNICALLY, IF A CLIENT WANTS TO OPT OUT OF, SAY, GETTING TREATMENT, WE CAN'T TERMINATE THEM FROM THE PROGRAM. SO I FOUND THAT TO BE VERY PROBLEMATIC. YEAH. BECAUSE THAT'S THAT'S THE REASON MOST OF THE TIME THAT THEY'RE HOMELESS. 
          IS THAT THEY NEED YEAH, WHATEVER SUPPORT, WHETHER IT'S MENTAL HEALTH OR, SUBSTANCE ABUSE IT, YOU KNOW, I SEE THAT AS A BIG PROBLEM. ABSOLUTELY. AND IT IS A PROBLEM. THAT'S UNFORTUNATE. 
          THANK YOU. THANK YOU. COUNCILMAN HUDSON. THANK YOU. CHAIR, I WANTED TO COME BACK TO MY, PREVIOUS QUESTION ON IS THERE IS THERE SOME KIND OF DATA OR EVIDENCE THAT SHOWS THAT $5,000 IS ENOUGH OF AN INCENTIVE? BECAUSE BY DEFINITION, THERE'S A PAIN POINT THAT THE LANDLORD HAS TO BE TAKEN BEYOND IN ORDER FOR THEM TO ACCEPT THE PEOPLE WE'RE TRYING TO GET INTO HOUSING. IS THAT THE RIGHT NUMBER? YOU KNOW, IT'S A REALLY GOOD QUESTION. WE'RE GOING TO WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO TRACK IT, WHEN I LOOKED AT OTHER COMMUNITIES THAT ARE DOING LANDLORD INCENTIVE PROGRAMS, THOUSAND DOLLARS FOR A NEW LANDLORD AT THE START OF THE LEASE, NOW THEY CAN HAVE THERE COULD BE MULTIPLE TENANTS, SO IT'D BE $1,000 FOR EACH NEW PLACEMENT, THAT SEEMS TO BE ON PAR WITH OTHER COMMUNITIES THAT I'VE RESEARCHED QUITE A BIT, AND THIS IS PRETTY PREVALENT AGAIN, BECAUSE OF THE PANDEMIC. RENTAL MARKETS JUST GOT REALLY, REALLY TIGHT ACROSS THE COUNTRY. YOU KNOW, THERE ARE SOME COMMUNITIES DOING UP TO 1500 FOR A NEW PROPERTY OWNER LANDLORD, THERE'S SOME DOING AS LITTLE AS 500, SO THAT'S SOMETHING THAT'S, YOU KNOW, I THINK, YOU KNOW, WE WANT 
          [00:20:03]
TO GET THIS APPROVED FIRST, OBVIOUSLY, AND THEN WE'RE GOING TO REALLY NAIL DOWN THE SCALE THAT WE'RE GOING TO USE. OBVIOUSLY WE HAVE A SHORTAGE OF THREE AND FOUR BEDROOM UNITS. WE HAVE A LOT OF FAMILIES. YOU KNOW, THE YOU'VE GOT THE HEAD OF HOUSEHOLD THAT HAS A DOCUMENTED DISABILITY AND THEY GOT THREE KIDS. WELL, WE NEED A NEED A 3 OR 4 BEDROOM. AND THEY ARE JUST IN SUCH SHORT SUPPLY. SO WE MAY DO A SCALE WHERE WE DO UP TO 2000 FOR A THREE, 3 OR 4 BEDROOM, AND IT WOULD BE A ONE TIME INCENTIVE AT THE START. NOW ANOTHER THING WE COULD DO THAT OTHER CITIES HAVE DONE IS THEY'VE BUILT IN A BACK END INCENTIVE. AT THE 12 MONTH MARK. 
          AT THE END OF THE LEASE, YOU COULD DO A SECONDARY INCENTIVE. AND THAT'S SOMETHING THAT, YOU KNOW, I THINK WE WILL DEVELOP IN THE NEXT 30 DAYS AFTER APPROVAL, HOW THAT WILL LOOK, HOW LOCKED IN IS THE LANDLORD ONCE THEY ACCEPT THE INCENTIVE? YEAH, I CAN SEE MOVING INTO PERSON WHO IS YOU KNOW, I CAN SEE MOVING INTO PERSON WHO WHO IS DEALING WITH THEIR HEALTH ISSUES APPROPRIATELY, AND WHILE THEY'RE IN TREATMENT, THINGS ARE FINE, YOU ACCEPT THE INCENTIVE, THE PERSON MOVES IN FIRST THREE MONTHS, THEY'RE IN YOUR APARTMENT COMPLEX. THEY'RE HANDLING THEIR HEALTH ISSUES, AND THEN THEY MAKE A DECISION NOT TO HANDLE THEIR HEALTH ISSUES ANYMORE. AND THAT BECOMES A PROBLEM NOT ONLY FOR THE PROPERTY OWNER, BUT FOR EVERY OTHER RESIDENT IN THAT COMPLEX. AND NOW THE PROPERTY OWNER IS LEFT WITH A, YOU KNOW, DO I ACT ON MY LEASE, WHICH ALLOWS ME TO MOVE THEM OUT, OR AM I OBLIGATED BECAUSE I TOOK THIS INCENTIVE? RIGHT, RIGHT. YEAH. I MEAN, I THINK THAT'S YOU KNOW, OBVIOUSLY A LEASE IS A LEGAL BINDING DOCUMENT FOR 12 MONTHS, SIGNED BY THE TENANT AND THE LANDLORD. WE'RE THERE. WE DO A, WE DO A THIRD PARTY LEASE IN ADDITION, THAT BINDS US TO THE VOUCHER COMMITMENT. YEAH, A COUPLE THINGS. ONE ISSUE, WITH OUR CONTINUUM OF CARE, HUD FUNDING, WE CAN DO A SECOND DEPOSIT FOR EXCESSIVE DAMAGE AND THAT FREQUENCY. SO WE'RE PAYING FOR THAT OUT OF OUR REGULAR GRANT FUNDS THAT COME FROM HUD, BUT TO YOUR POINT, I THINK CONSIDERATION COULD BE GIVEN IN AN EXTREME CASE. FOR INSTANCE, FOR AN EVEN ANOTHER INCENTIVE AT THE END FOR EXCESSIVE DAMAGE. 
          AND THAT'S SOMETHING THAT COMMUNITIES HAVE DONE ON OTHER COMMUNITIES, BUT PAYING THAT SECOND DEPOSIT FOR EXCESSIVE DAMAGE IS PRETTY STANDARD ACROSS CONTINUUM OF CARES THROUGHOUT THE UNITED STATES, YOU HAD ANOTHER PART TO THE QUESTION. THERE ARE LEASES THAT ALLOW FOR PROPERTY OWNERS TO REMOVE SOMEONE WHO IS A THREAT TO THE PROPERTY OR TO OTHER TENANTS, RIGHT? I MEAN, IF YOU'RE IT HAPPENS ALL THE TIME, YOU SHOULDN'T HAVE TO LIVE NEXT DOOR TO SOMEBODY THAT IS A THREAT TO YOU. YEAH, IT HAPPENS, I DON'T WANT TO SAY WEEKLY, BUT BI WEEKLY WE HAVE THAT SITUATION IN OUR DEPARTMENT AND ULTIMATELY, I HAVE TO MAKE A CALL ON WHETHER WE CONTINUE TO SUPPORT THE CLIENT AND GET THEM REHOUSED WITH A NEW PROPERTY OWNER, BECAUSE CERTAINLY, IF THEY'RE A PROPERTY OWNER BUILDS IN A LANDLORD, BUILDS IN VARIOUS LANGUAGE THAT THEY CAN TERMINATE PRIOR TO 12 MONTHS. AND THAT HAPPENS. AND BUT THE INCENTIVE DOESN'T PREVENT THEM FROM ACTING ON THEIR LEASE. WELL, I MEAN, THAT'S SOMETHING WE CAN CONSIDER. I'M ACTUALLY RESEARCHING THAT NOW, WHETHER, WHAT KIND OF BINDING LANGUAGE WE CAN REALLY BUILD INTO THE INCENTIVE. AND I'M GETTING IT'S A LITTLE TOUGH TO FIND THAT LEVEL OF DETAIL, BUT, I'LL BE HAPPY TO REPORT BACK TO YOU. I WOULD THINK THAT'S A FINE LINE TO WALK. RIGHT? IT IS. IT IS IF YOU ALLOW THAT TENANTS, IF YOU ALLOW THAT, OWNERS CAN GET OUT OF THE INCENTIVE, THEN THEY BRING SOMEBODY IN, KEEP THEM FOR THREE MONTHS, AND THEN THEY REMOVE THEM. BUT IF YOU DON'T. YEAH. THEN YOU PUT A TENANT IN AS A LANDOWNER IN A SITUATION WHERE EVERY OTHER TENANT IN THEIR BUILDING MAY BE TEMPTED TO LEAVE AT THE END OF THEIR LEASE, AT WHICH POINT THAT INCENTIVE MEANT NOTHING. WELL, YOU'D BE AMAZED, I'VE GOT A FULL TIME INSPECTOR, AND I'M ALSO CERTIFIED TO DO HOUSING QUALITY STANDARDS INSPECTIONS. I'M OUT THERE ALL THE TIME, LAYING MY OWN EYES ON WHEN THESE KIND OF ISSUES ARISE. YOU KNOW, YOU GOT YOU GOT OUR PROPERTY OWNER AND LANDLORD SAYING, I'VE GOT EXCESSIVE DAMAGE. YOU GOT OUR TENANT, OUR CLIENT SAYING, WELL, THAT'S NOT THE CASE. YOU KNOW, I'VE GOT TO GO OUT THERE AND BE THE MIDDLEMAN. A LOT OF TIMES. AND AGAIN, WE SHOULD POINT OUT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE EXCEPTION HERE. WE'RE TALKING ABOUT SOMEBODY WHO'S RIGHT. THIS IS SOMEBODY WHO'S HEALTH HAS DETERIORATED TO A POINT. RIGHT. WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT. THAT'S RIGHT, COUNCILMAN HUDSON, WERE YOU BACK IN? I WAS BACK IN. I'M SORRY TO KEEP HARPING ON THIS QUESTION, BUT THE MATH JUST AIN'T MATH. AND FOR ME YET. WHEN I ASKED IF $5,000 WAS THE RIGHT INCENTIVE, YOUR RESPONSE WAS THAT, WELL, IT'S $1,000 OR SOME PLACES DO $500. IS THE ADMINISTRATIVE COST LIKE 80? SO WHERE'S THE OTHER MONEY GOING? SO I THINK THE DETAILS AS FAR AS HOW WE'LL, KIND OF MAP OUT THE 
          [00:25:03]
BUDGET ARE STILL WE'RE STILL WORKING ON THAT, YOU KNOW, IT'S VERY POSSIBLE WE COULD SERVE MORE THAN 175. AND IN FACT, I THINK THAT WOULD BE LIKELY, I THINK PART OF HAVING A PILOT IS BEING ABLE TO KIND OF SEE WHAT'S EFFECTIVE AND WHAT'S NOT, AS WELL AS LOOKING AT WHAT'S BEEN DONE IN OTHER CITIES, AND LOOKING AT WHAT THE MARKET WILL BEAR, TOO. I MEAN, I THINK THAT, IN OUR CONVERSATIONS WITH LANDLORDS THAT WE'VE ALREADY STARTED, IF A THOUSAND DOESN'T SEEM LIKE ENOUGH OF AN INCENTIV, AS JOE MENTIONED, WE CAN INCREASE THAT AMOUNT TO, BUT BUT THE GOAL IS NOT TO, UTILIZE THIS FOR OVERHEAD OR ADMINISTRATIVE COSTS. WE WANT THIS TO GO STRAIGHT TO ENCOURAGING LANDLORDS TO, TO RENT TO OUR CLIENTS, SO I DO WANT TO, WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE CLEAR ABOUT THAT, THAT THIS THIS REALLY IS DESIGNED SOLELY TO HOUSE MORE PEOPLE, NOT TO KIND OF, UNDERWRITE OUR STAFF OR OUR CSS, BUT BUT TO BE AND I THINK IT'S AN EXCELLENT POINT BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, WHEN WE BREAK DOWN THE TOTAL DOLLAR AMOUNTS, AND AS YOU'RE ALREADY SEEING IT GIVES US A LITTLE MORE ROOM TO MAYBE EXPLORE, ADDITIONAL INCENTIVES AND NOT JUST ON THE FRONT END, BUT, INCENTIVES FOR MAINTAINING OUR PEOPLE KIND OF GOES BACK TO THE IMMEDIATE CONVERSATION. WE'RE HAVING. I MEAN, I THINK THAT, OBVIOUSLY A LEASE IS A LEGALLY BINDING AGREEMENT. BUT IF YOU'RE ALSO GOING TO PARTNER WITH US ON THIS INCENTIVE PROGRAM, THEN I THINK, YOU KNOW, ON BOTH SIDES, THERE'S EXPECTATIONS THAT WE'RE GOING TO HAVE AN EVEN MORE ROBUST PARTNERSHIP, YOU KNOW, SO THE EXPECTATION, AND THIS, OF COURSE, WOULD ALL BE IN WRITING AND WOULD BE LEGALLY BINDING THAT YOU'RE GOING TO WORK WITH US. NOT THAT YOU CAN'T EVICT SOMEONE WHO IS CONSISTENTLY PROBLEMATIC, BECAUSE, AGAIN, WE WANT OUR NEIGHBORS TO BE SAFE AND SECURE, BUT I DO THINK THERE'S A HIGHER EXPECTATION IN THIS PILOT THAT YOU'RE GOING TO COMMIT TO WORKING WITH US, OUR COMMITMENT THEN IS THAT WE'RE GOING TO BE RESPONSIVE. WE'RE GOING TO COMMUNICATE, AND WE'RE GOING TO PROVIDE A HIGH LEVEL OF SERVICE, WHICH IS WHAT WE ALWAYS ALREADY DO. I THINK THAT'S ONE OF THE MAIN POINTS WITH THE PILOT. LIKE THIS, IS THAT, WE'RE HOPING THAT LANDLORDS, ONCE THEY SEE THE LEVEL OF SERVICE THAT WE PROVIDE AND THE LEVEL OF SUPERVISION AND SUPPORT THAT THEY'LL KNOW THAT THIS IS, MORE APPEALING THAN JUST SOMEONE WHO COMES OFF THE STREET AS A TENANT, BECAUSE WE'RE GOING TO BE IN CONSTANT COMMUNICATION. WE'RE GOING TO TAKE THEIR CALLS, EVEN ONES LATE AT NIGHT, AND WE'RE GOING TO TRY TO TROUBLESHOOT AND SOLVE THOSE PROBLEMS. SO IF THEY'RE COMMITTING TO WORK WITH US AND GIVE THESE PEOPLE MORE OF A CHANCE THAN THEY MIGHT HAVE, WE'RE GOING TO ALSO DO OUR PART TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE TRYING TO WORK THESE THINGS OUT AND MAKE IT A REALLY BENEFICIAL PARTNERSHIP BOTH WAYS. SO DON'T DON'T TAKE MY QUESTIONS AS CRITICISM. I WANT TO SEE THIS SUCCEED. YEAH, I'LL BE A YES VOTE ON THIS, BUT IT WILL BE CONDITIONAL. I'D LIKE TO SEE YOU COME BACK ON A QUARTERLY BASIS TO GIVE US AN UPDATE ON THE SUCCESS OF THE PROGRAM, AND THAT WE'RE NOT JUST ENRICHING LANDLORDS. ABSOLUTELY THANK YOU. 
          YEAH. THANK YOU. AND I APPRECIATE YOUR QUESTIONS BECAUSE IT IS THE GOAL IS TO REALLY MOVE THE NEEDLE FOR HOUSING THOSE WHO ARE MOST VULNERABLE. SO I ABSOLUTELY AGREE. SO ARTHUR, THANK YOU. JUST TO ADDRESS A CONCERN, ONE OF MY COLLEAGUES HAD IN THE PILOT, COULD YOU SPREAD THE PAYMENTS OUT MONTH TO MONTH AS OPPOSED TO A ONE TIME INFUSION OF CASH TO THE LANDLORD? THAT WAY, IF THERE IS AN ISSUE WITH THE LEASE, WE MIGHT BE ABLE TO JUST TERMINATE AN AGREEMENT THEY HAVE WITH YOU. YEAH, I THINK I THINK THAT'S YES, I THINK THAT'S, ONE PROGRAM DESIGN THAT WE COULD DEFINITELY LOOK AT. I THINK, AN UPFRONT INCENTIVE IS GOING TO BE HELPFUL AS FAR AS GETTING FOLKS TO BUY INTO THE PROGRAM. BUT THEN, YOU KNOW, WE WANT IT TO BE A PARTNERSHIP THAT WE CAN TRACK ON AN ONGOING BASIS AND HOPEFULLY JUST MAKE IT MUTUALLY BENEFICIAL. UNDERSTOOD. AND YOU COULD SPLIT IT. YOU COULD GIVE SOMETHING UP FRONT AND THEN LET THEM KNOW, YOU KNOW, MONTH TO MONTH, AS LONG AS YOU KEEP WORKING WITH US AND WORKING WITH THE CLIENT, WE'LL ADD TO THE RENT OR SOME SORT OF FEE. BUT I'M JUST CURIOUS IF OTHER CITIES HAVE TRIED THAT AND IF WE COULD TRY IT. SO WE ABSOLUTELY DO HAVE TO TIE, INCENTIVES TO OUR PRIMARY GOAL, WHICH IS KEEPING PEOPLE HOUSED FOR LONGER PERIODS OF TIME. 
          REALLY, OUR GOAL IS PERMANENT HOUSING, BECAUSE OUR, AS MOST OF OUR PEOPLE HAVE PERMANENT SUPPORTING, SUPPORTIVE HOUSING VOUCHERS SO THEY COULD BE HOUSED, IN INDEFINITELY. SO WE WANT LANDLORDS TO BE ON BOARD WITH THAT. AND I THINK PART OF THAT IS PROVIDING INCREMENTAL INCENTIVES, AND AGAIN, WE'RE HAPPY TO COME BACK TO COUNCIL WITH MORE DETAIL, IN VERY SHORT ORDER ABOUT THAT. DID YOU WANT TO SAY ANYTHING ELSE, JOE? YEAH OKAY. THANK YOU. SO JUST A CLARIFICATION. AND I'M NOT A MATH GUY ON THAT RIGHT FROM THE BEGINNING, I DID HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT, LIKE, HOW MANY LANDLORDS YOU HAD SUGGESTED THAT THAT YOU KNOW, WITH THE INCENTIVE MIGHT BE PER TENANT. RIGHT. LIKE SO YOU'D WORK WITH THE LANDLORD. SO I'M CURIOUS HOW MANY LANDLORDS YOU ANTICIPATE WORKING WITH. BUT BUT BEFORE I GET THERE, IF IT'S 175, PERSONS THAT THAT YOU'RE 
          [00:30:05]
LOOKING AT, JUST QUICK MATH, $234,000 IS WHAT'S LEFT IN THIS FUND. IT WAS ORIGINALLY NOT 100,000, BUT. OH, YEAH, IT'S ONLY 200. I SHOULDN'T SAY ONLY. I MEAN, 234 IS REAL MONEY. IT DOES. OKAY, GOOD. THEN THEN THEN I DON'T NEED TO GO ANY FURTHER WITH THE MATH PIECE. SURE, BUT I AM CURIOUS. DO YOU HAVE A SENSE? AND YOU MAY NOT, BECAUSE IT'S A PALETTE, BUT DO YOU HAVE A SENSE OF HOW MANY LANDLORDS WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HERE OR. WELL, I MEAN, I'M GOING TO I'M GOING TO DEFER TO JOE ON THIS ONE. BUT HE'S I KNOW AS HE'S ALREADY SAID, YOU KNOW, WE'VE SEEN A NET REDUCTION IN THE NUMBER OF LANDLORDS AND PROPERTY OWNERS THAT WE CAN WORK WITH BECAUSE OF, BIGGER COMPANIES, BASICALLY TAKING MORE OF THE SUPPLY, AND HE MENTIONED ALL TRADE, WHICH, WHICH WAS A GOOD PARTNER AND NO LONGER WE HAVE AS IS, IS IN THE COMMUNITY. SO, I'LL TURN IT OVER TO JOE, BUT I IMAGINE IT'S GOING TO BE FEWER THAN WE WOULD LIKE. BUT I THINK ONE OF THE STRENGTHS THAT I'VE SEEN IN MY SHORT TIME AT RCS IS THAT JOE AND HIS TEAM HAVE FORMED RELATIONSHIPS WITH, AS HE SAID, MOM AND POP LANDLORDS. YOU KNOW, THOSE SMALLER PROPERTY OWNERS, HOPEFULLY WE CAN BRING MORE OF THOSE FOLKS ONLINE, WHICH THEN BEGS THE QUESTION, THEN AS YOU'RE MOVING UP, I'LL GO AHEAD AND ASK IT, IT BEGS THE QUESTION, SO THERE IS A LOUISVILLE APARTMENT ASSOCIATION? YEAH, I HAVE TO ASSUME THAT THERE'S A CONVERSATION. YEAH, YEAH, YEAH, WE I'VE BEEN IN COMMUNICATION WITH THEM. YOU KNOW, I THINK TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION, COUNCILMAN KRAMER, I HONESTLY DREAMING BIG. I WOULD LOVE TO DOUBLE OUR VENDOR. YOU KNOW, I USE THE TERM VENDORS, BUT THAT'S WHAT WE CALL IT IN OUR SYSTEM. BUT THEY'RE OUT THERE. YOU KNOW, I THINK IT'S A COMBINATION OF SOME STIGMA ABOUT FOLKS WITH VOUCHERS NOT WANTING TO GET INTO THIS GAME, EVEN THOUGH, AS YOU KNOW, DIRECTOR SWETNAM SAID, WE PROVIDE THAT WRAPAROUND SUPPORT AND THAT ASSURANCE, AND WE'RE GOING TO BE EYES ON THE UNIT, BUT BUT IT'S A CHALLENGE. IT'S A CHALLENGE. AND I DON'T SEE WHY WE COULDN'T DOUBLE OUR SUPPLY OF AVAILABLE LANDLORDS AND PROPERTY OWNERS. AND THAT WOULD BE, YOU KNOW, THAT'S DREAMING BIG. BUT, YOU KNOW, WE'VE PROBABLY GOT 60, 70 NOW. WE'VE GOT, YOU KNOW, A LOT OF TENANTS ARE IN THE SAME THE SAME PROPERTY GROUP LANDLORDS. SO I THINK IT'S A IT'S EXCITING. IT COULD BE A GAME CHANGER. OKAY, GREAT, COUNCILMAN FOWLER, THANK YOU, S. I GUESS I'M GOING BACK TO THE, INCENTIVIZING THE CLIENT TO STAY IN THE PROGRAM BECAUSE I CAN SEE THE RELUCTANCE OF THE LANDLORD, BECAUSE IF THEY CHOOSE NOT TO STAY WITH THE WRAPAROUND SERVICES AND GET HELP WITH WHATEVER ISSUE IT MIGHT BE, THAT IT'S KEEPING THEM HOMELESS, THAT, YOU KNOW, THEY ARE GOING IF LEFT TO THEIR OWN DEVICES, THEY'LL THEY'RE GOING TO GET EVICTED IN IN A SHORT ORDER BECAUSE THEY HAVEN'T ADDRESSED THOSE. IN SOME CASES, WE HAVE MANY CLIENTS THAT HAVE BEEN IN THE PROGRAM TEN PLUS YEARS THAT HAVE DRAMATICALLY STABILIZED TO THE POINT WHERE THEY'RE ACTUALLY THINKING ABOUT POTENTIALLY LEAVING THE PROGRAM TO BUY A HOME. YEAH, GOOD. SO WE HAVE A LOT OF THOSE SUCCESSES. IT'S NO, JUST THE REALLY VULNERABLE HIGH NEEDS. I MEAN, A LOT OF PEOPLE COME IN THAT WAY BECAUSE EVERYBODY'S GOT DOCUMENTED DISABILITY WHEN WE TAKE THEM IN. 
          BUT THE IDEA IS THAT THEY STABILIZE OVER TIME AND THAT EVEN THOUGH IT IS PERMANENT SUPPORTIVE HOUSING AND PERMANENT IS THE OPERATIVE WORD, YOU KNOW, THEY CAN ESSENTIALLY THE REST OF THEIR LIFE IF THEY FOLLOW THE RULES AND THEY FOLLOW THEIR LEASE, THEY CAN STAY IN THE PROGRAM. BUT ULTIMATELY WE WANT WE WANT THEM TO EVEN AIM HIGHER. AND WE'VE WE HAVE THAT THOSE THAT DOCUMENTED SUCCESS OVER THE YEARS, YOU TALKED ABOUT INCENTIVES FOR THE TENANT. YEAH. 
          YOU KNOW, THE BIG INCENTIVES THAT WE'RE PAYING THE RENT, OBVIOUSLY, AND YOU KNOW, FAIR MARKET RENTS ARE OUTRAGEOUS FOR JEFFERSON COUNTY, THEY'VE GONE UP EXPONENTIALLY THE LAST 3 OR 4 YEARS, AND, YOU KNOW, WE DO SOME OTHER INCENTIVES. WE YOU KNOW, OBVIOUSLY WE PROVIDE, TARC PASSES, MONTHLY PASSES, ESPECIALLY IF YOU'RE SEEKING EMPLOYMENT. I MEAN, IT'S GOT TO BE A DOCUMENTED REASON WHY WE DO CARE PACKAGES, YOU KNOW, WE DO POTS AND PANS, TOWELS FOR MOVE IN, AND THEN, YOU KNOW, AND I DO THINK THE RELATIONSHIP PART OF IT. RIGHT. SO A LOT OF OUR, YOU KNOW, I'VE GOT A WHOLE TEAM OF CASE MANAGERS AND THEY WIND UP BUILDING STRONG RAPPORT WITH OUR CLIENTS AND TO THE POINT WHERE IN AN EMERGENCY, THEY'RE CALLING US INSTEAD OF CALLING A FRIEND OR SOMEBODY ELSE. I MEAN, THAT RAPPORT HAS BEEN BUILT AND THERE'S A TRUST FACTOR. SO ALL THAT IS REALLY THE INCENTIVES ON THE TENANTS TO FOLLOW THE RULES, RIGHT? AND STAY HOUSED. THANK 
          [00:35:01]
YOU. YEP SEEING NO ONE ELSE IN THE QUEUE, THIS IS AN ORDINANCE. CALLS FOR A ROLL CALL VOTE. 
          MADAM CLERK, IF YOU PLEASE, OPEN VOTING. OH, IS THERE AN AMENDMENT? MR. CHAIRMAN, YOU HAD A HAND RAISED. I'M SORRY, COUNCILWOMAN, THE FLOOR IS YOUR. ACTUALLY, COUNCILWOMAN PARKER. 
          COUNCILWOMAN PARKER, THE FLOOR IS YOURS. THANK YOU. SORRY. PRIME GOVT AT HOME WOULDN'T LET ME SIGN IN, TO SPEAK. I WAS JUST CURIOUS. I KNOW THAT ON AVERAGE, THERE'S, LIKE SIX MONTHS. IT TAKES ALMOST SIX MONTHS TO EVICT SOMEONE. SO WOULD RCS BE ABLE TO STEP IN IF THERE WAS A NEED AND BE ABLE TO SPEED UP THAT PROCESS SO THAT THEY CAN MOVE THE NEXT PERSON IN LINE? THAT WAS, YOU KNOW, WILL WILLING TO GET TREATMENT AND THEN DO WHAT THEY NEEDED TO DO TO STAY IN THE HOUSING. YEAH THIS IS JOE AGAIN, ABSOLUTELY. YOU KNOW, WE, YOU KNOW, LANDLORDS TRUST US TO. SO AT THE A LOT OF TIMES AT THE FIRST HINT OF ISSUES, THEY'RE CALLING US. RIGHT. AND SO THAT'S WHERE MY INSPECTION TEAM MYSELF GO OUT THERE. AND IF IT'S IF IT'S FOUNDED, WE CAN ENCOURAGE THE TENANT. YOU KNOW, WE'VE BEEN ABLE TO SUCCEED AT HEADING OFF PROBLEMS WITHOUT IT TAKING SIX MONTHS TO GO TO EVICTION COURT AND ALL THAT WE DO. IN FACT, WE DO THAT EVERY DAY. OKAY BUT ONCE IT DOES GO TO EVICTION COURT, ARE YOU ABLE TO SPEED UP THE PROCESS? NO NO, THAT'S. YEAH SO THAT'S THROUGH EVICTION COURT. THAT'S SAID TO ME, THAT'S WHAT STINKS FOR THE, THE RENTING FACILITY. SO AND YOU'RE GIVING THEM $1,000 UP FRONT? MAYBE. BUT DID YOU SAY YOU'RE PAYING THEM THE COMPLETE RENT PLUS A THOUSAND? YES, YES. SO WE HAVE THE GRANT FUNDS THAT WE REAPPLY FOR EACH YEAR, THAT IS SPECIFICALLY PAYS UP TO THE FAIR MARKET RENT. RIGHT. SO SOMEBODY ZERO INCOME, WE'RE PAYING THE FULL RENT. ALL RIGHT. AND THEN YOU TALKED ABOUT YOUR SUCCESS RATE. CAN YOU DO YOU HAVE A PERCENTAGE. CAN YOU SHARE THAT, LAST YEAR, 93% MAINTAINED THEIR LEASE FOR 12 MONTHS SUCCESSFULLY AND DID NOT RETURN TO HOMELESSNESS IN THE STREETS. 
          OKAY OKAY. ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU. YEP ALL RIGHT. I'LL LOOK AT THE SCREEN THIS TIME AND SEE FOR HANDS. ALL RIGHT. GOOD, NO ONE IS IN THE QUEUE. NO ONE HAS THEIR HAND UP, THIS IS AN ORDINANCE THAT IS, AMENDING ORDINANCE 143. SO IT IS AN ORDINANCE THAT CALLS FOR A ROLL CALL VOTE. MADAM CLERK, IF YOU PLEASE, OPEN THE VOTING. OKAY. VOTING IS CLOSING. CAN WE, COUNCIL MEMBER MCCRANIE. YES. COUNCIL MEMBER OWEN. YES. HOLDINGS CLOSING. THANK YOU, MADAM CLERK. YES. VOTES EIGHT. YES VOTES ZERO. NO VOTES. THIS WILL GO TO THE CONSENT CALENDAR, 
          [2.
 O-143-24     AN ORDINANCE AMENDING ORDINANCE NO. 075, SERIES 2022, RELATING TO THE AMERICAN RESCUE PLAN (ARP) LOCAL FISCAL RECOVERY FUNDING TO VARIOUS LOUISVILLE METRO GOVERNMENT DEPARTMENTS TO ADDRESS THE CONTINUED IMPACT OF COVID-19 ON THE ECONOMY, PUBLIC HEALTH, STATE AND LOCAL GOVERNMENTS, INDIVIDUALS, AND BUSINESSES BY AMENDING LANGUAGE PERTAINING TO THE RHODIA BROWNFIELDS REMEDIATION PROJECT (LAT-0075).
Action Required By: December 2024
Sponsors: Phillip T. Baker (D-6) ]
ITEM NUMBER TWO IS ORDINANCE ONE 4324, IT IS AN ORDINANCE AMENDING ORDINANCE NUMBER 75, SERIES 2022 RELATING TO THE AMERICAN RESCUE PLAN, AARP LOCAL FISCAL RECOVERY FUNDING TO VARIOUS LOUISVILLE METRO GOVERNMENT DEPARTMENTS TO ADDRESS THE CONTINUED IMPACT OF COVID 19 ON THE ECONOMY. PUBLIC HEALTH, STATE AND LOCAL GOVERNMENTS, INDIVIDUALS, AND BUSINESSES BY AMENDING LANGUAGE PERTAINING TO THE RHODIA BROWNFIELDS REMEDIATION PROJECT. 
          YOUR MOTION OKAY, IT'S PROPERLY BEFORE US, PROPERLY MOVED AND SECONDED, AND AGAIN, KEN HILDEBRAND IS HERE TO SPEAK TO THIS. THANK YOU. KEN HILDEBRAND, LOUISVILLE ACCELERATOR TEAM WITH THE OFFICE OF MANAGEMENT AND BUDGET. THIS ITEM IS REQUESTING AN AMENDMENT TO THE ORIGINAL LANGUAGE TO ADD AND SITE INFRASTRUCTURE. SO THE APPROPRIATION ORIGINAL APPROPRIATION WAS FOR BROWNFIELD REMEDIATION. THAT REMEDIATION IS COMPLETE ON ON THE SITE THAT WE'VE BEEN ABLE TO DO. AND WHAT WE'D LIKE TO LOOK AT IS ADDING ANY SITE INFRASTRUCTURE TYPE WORK TO THE SITE TO IMPROVE THE DEVELOPMENT OF THAT SITE. I CAN ADDRESS ANY ARP MECHANICAL QUESTIONS, AND JEFF O'BRIEN FROM THE CABINET FOR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CAN ANSWER ANY PROGRAMMATIC QUESTIONS REGARDING RHODIUM. THANK YOU, COUNCILMAN FOWLER, WAS THIS ORIGINALLY FROM THE HEALTHY NEIGHBORHOODS? HEALTHY NEIGHBORHOODS, HEALTHY LOUISVILLE WORKFORCE? YES OKAY. 
          [00:40:01]
AND SO. HOW MUCH IS LEFT OVER? THERE IS ABOUT A 1.3 MILLION THAT'S REMAINING. THAT'S UNBUDGETED AT THIS TIME, THERE ARE SOME EXPENSES THAT ARE GOING TO BE COMING. THE ORIGINAL APPROPRIATION WAS $10 MILLION FOR THIS PROJECT. IT'S ABOUT $1.3 MILLION LEFT. THERE ARE SOME COSTS THAT THEY'VE IDENTIFIED. THE STATE IS CURRENTLY LOOKING AT THE, THE WORK THAT'S BEEN DONE AND MAY COME BACK AND SAY, WELL, YOU ALSO NEED TO DO THIS. JEFF MIGHT BE ABLE TO EXPLAIN EXACTLY HOW THAT WORKS FOR BROWNFIELD REMEDIATION. I KNOW THERE'S A FENCE THAT NEEDS TO BE REPAIRED ON THE SITE. SO THOSE KIND OF THINGS WILL COME, WILL COME OUT OF THIS. BUT THEN THE SITE INFRASTRUCTURE WOULD BE OTHER OTHER PROJECTS THAT JEFF IS LOOKING AT WITH THE ONLY REASON I ASK THAT IS BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE AN ISSUE IN JEFFERSON MEMORIAL FOREST THAT COULD PROBABLY USE SOME FUNDING. SO THANK YOU. OKAY ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? AGAIN, THIS WAS FUNDING ORIGINALLY TO TAKE CARE OF THIS BROWNFIELD, THE REMEDIATION THAT WE HAD A PLAN WITH, THE 10 MILLION CAME IN UNDER BUDGET. THE PROPERTY IS CURRENTLY, PREPARED FOR SALE. IS THAT RIGHT? AND THAT'S OUR HOPE. YES. SO THE PROPERTY IS OWNED BY METRO GOVERNMENT. THERE'S THIS IS A 17 ACRE SITE. IT'S A BROWNFIELD SITE. IT WAS, RHODIA WAS A SOLVENT MANUFACTURING COMPANY. THE CITY PURCHASED THE PROPERTY IN 1997. IT'S ONE OF THE FIRST PROGRAM PROPERTIES THAT WAS ENTERED INTO THE FEDERAL PILOT BROWNFIELD PROGRAM, SO THIS THIS PROPERTY WAS PUT UP FOR, SALE THROUGH A AN OPEN SOY BIDDING PROCESS IN 2000, 21. WE'VE HAD A WE'VE PROCURED A DEVELOPER THROUGH THAT OPEN PROCESS. RE LAND DEVELOPMENT IS THE GROUP THAT'S BEEN PREPARED THAT HAS BEEN PROCURED. THEY HAVE BEEN GOING THROUGH THE PROCESS, TO DEVELOP APARTMENTS ON THE NORTHERN HALF OF THE SITE, WHICH IS WHERE THE $10 MILLION, WHICH IS WHERE THE $8.7 MILLION THE CITY SPENT SO FAR HAS, FOCUSED THE REMEDIATION WORK. THEY'VE RECEIVED AN ALLOCATION OF $32 MILLION FROM THE KENTUCKY HOUSING CORPORATION FOR REDEVELOPMENT OF THE SITE, THESE WOULD BE AFFORDABLE HOUSING UNITS AT THE AT THE 60% AMI RANGE. THAT'S WHAT THE, THE LOW INCOME HOUSING TAX CREDIT PROGRAM REQUIRES, AS MR. HILDEBRANDT'S AND I'M SORRY, JEFF O'BRIEN EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, CABINET I'M VERY SORRY. I JUST JUMPED RIGHT IN THERE, AS MR. HILDEBRAND SAID, THE, THE PROJECT DID COME IN UNDER BUDGET. WE RECEIVED SOME INITIAL COMMENTS BACK FROM THE STATE, IN FACT ARE GETTING WE LOOKED AT THE DRAFT, RESPONSE DOCUMENT TODAY. THEY'RE RELATIVELY MINOR COMMENTS, BUT WE DO HAVE SEVERAL OTHER STEPS TO GO WITH, ON THE STATE. WE'VE ALSO HAD SOME DRAINAGE ISSUES THAT WE'VE HAD TO MONITOR ON THE SITE, THAT MIGHT INCREASE SOME COSTS. AND AS KEN SAID, MR. HILBURN SAID, WE ARE REPAIRING A FENCE THAT WAS, THAT NEEDED TO BE REPAIRED AFTER REMEDIATION. SO COUNCILMAN PIAGENTINI, THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. JEFF, HOW HOW LONG HAS THAT BEEN, SORT OF VACANT, BROWNFIELD, THE SITE APPROXIMATELY. YES. SO WE'VE OWNED THE SITE FOR 27 YEARS, IT HAS BEEN VACANT AND UNDERUSED SINCE THEN, SO THAT'S IT'S BEEN APPROXIMATELY 30 YEARS SINCE THE SITE'S BEEN USED. YEAH, 30 YEARS OF, SOLVENTS AND OTHER CHEMICALS AND JUST ENVIRONMENTAL PROBLEMS IN THAT AREA, HOW MANY ACRES, TOTAL SITE IS 17 ACRES. YEAH. SO THANK YOU. SO, I REMEMBER THIS VERY, VERY, VERY, VERY DISTINCTLY, BECAUSE, IT WAS COUNCILWOMAN CASSIE CHAMBERS. ARMSTRONG WAS ON THIS WORK GROUP. FRANKLY, I PUSHED HER VERY HARD TO PUT MONEY INTO SOME BROWNFIELD REMEDIATION. AND THIS WAS ONE OF THE TOP PROJECTS BECAUSE OF ITS. HOW LONG IT HAD BEEN OUT THERE? OBVIOUSLY, IF THERE'S ANY MONEY LEFT OVER FROM, YOU KNOW, WHEN ALL THINGS ARE, WHEN ALL THE SHOOTING IS DONE RIGHT, THAT THIS COUNCIL SHOULD WEIGH IN ON HOW WE WANT TO REALLOCATE THAT, THAT MONEY. AND I'M SURE COUNCILMAN FOWLER MENTIONED ONE PROJECT. I'M SURE COUNCIL OTHER COUNCIL MEMBERS HAVE IDEAS OR THOUGHTS, AND THAT'S FINE. THAT'S GOOD, BUT I WOULD JUST SAY THAT, IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU'RE TRYING TO TIE THE BOW ON THIS, AND I DO NOT WANT TO GET, HAVE ANYBODY JUMP THE GUN ON, YOU KNOW, THOUGHTS ABOUT THIS BEING A SURPLUS UNTIL IT IS FULLY DONE? I MEAN, WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT DOING AND WHAT HAS BEEN DONE HERE IS GAME CHANGING WORK FOR THESE COMMUNITIES. IT'S IMPOSSIBLE UNLESS YOU LIVE NEAR 
          [00:45:02]
A BROWNFIELD. AND MY WIFE DOES THIS SORT OF ENVIRONMENTAL WORK. CELEBRITIES I KNOW HAVE SOME DETAIL ON THIS OF WHAT THIS DOES TO A COMMUNITY AND HOW IT DESTROYS IT IN SO MANY WAYS FROM A PUBLIC HEALTH POINT OF VIEW, ALL THE WAY THROUGH. AND AFFORDABILITY, WHAT IT DOES TO LOCAL PROPERTY VALUES AND THEN THE FACT THAT WE'RE USING IT TO DEVELOP 60% AMI WHEN MOST OF OU, AFFORDABLE HOUSING IS AT 80% IS INCREDIBLE. I MEAN, SO THIS IS A GREAT SUCCESS STORY, I HOPE THIS ALL COMPLETES THE WAY WE EXPECT IT TO, BUT OF COURSE, IF THERE'S MONEY LEFT OVER RIGHT, THEN WE'LL TAKE A LOOK AT THAT. BUT GLAD TO SEE THIS ALL BEING WRAPPED UP. AND GLAD TO SEE THIS LOOKING LIKE A TREMENDOUS SUCCESS STORY. AND I THINK WE DO NEED TO LOOK AT THIS MOVING FORWARD. AS YOU KNOW, HOW DO WE KEEP TAKING CHUNKS OUT OF THE BROWNFIELDS? BECAUSE THERE'S MORE THAN THIS. AND HOW DO WE KEEP MAKING PROGRESS OVER TIME? IT'S NOT GOING TO HAPPEN OVERNIGHT. BUT WE I MEAN, IT HAD BEFORE WE FUNDED THIS. DO YOU REMEMBER THE LAST BROWNFIELD PROJECT WE REMEDIATED IN THE CITY, YEAH. THE LAST ONE THAT WE ACTUALLY HAD A FEW OF THEM THAT WE RAN THROUGH IN THE, IN THE LAST DECADE, THE, THE WE'VE REALLY KIND OF TAKEN A CHUNK OUT OF THIS, BUT THE, PROBABLY THE MOST PROMINENT ONE WOULD BE THE SOCCER STADIUM THERE. THOSE AS EVERYBODY REMEMBER THAT AS A TANK FARM, THE CITY, THAT ACTUALLY WON THE PHOENIX AWARD, WHICH FOR THE BROWNFIELD TRADE ORGANIZATIONS, THAT'S A THAT'S THE HIGHEST AWARD THEY CAN GET. 
          WE'RE HOPING THAT THIS ONE, ONCE THE, DEVELOP THE SUBSEQUENT DEVELOPMENT OCCURS, WOULD BE THAT BECAUSE AGAIN, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT INFRASTRUCTURE HERE. SO I JUST I WANT TO BE TRANSPARENT ABOUT WHAT TYPE OF INFRASTRUCTURE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, THERE'S OBVIOUSLY THE TRADITIONAL UNDERGROUND INFRASTRUCTURE THAT WE'RE THINKING ABOUT. WE HAVE SOME NEEDS ON THE, ON THE ROADWAY AND THE SIDEWALKS HERE. BUT REALLY, WHAT THE DEVELOPER IS HOPING TO DO IS BUILD A NET ZERO, DEVELOPMENT. AND SO PART OF THAT WOULD BE INTRODUCING SOME SOLAR PANELS, WHICH WE'VE I THINK WAS IN, MR. HILDEBRAND'S COVER MEMO THERE. SO THEY'RE THEY THEY HAVE BEEN WORKING VERY CLOSELY WITH THE NEIGHBORHOOD, WHICH IS A I'M SURE THOSE OF YOU THAT ARE FAMILIAR WITH THE PARK HILL NEIGHBORHOOD KNOW THAT THESE POCKETS OF RESIDENTIAL ARE VERY ISOLATED AND AMONG VERY LARGE, HEAVY, HEAVY INDUSTRIAL USERS. SO THE DEVELOPER HERE HAS DONE A PHENOMENAL JOB, AND I CANNOT UNDERLINE, BOLD, CAPITALIZE THAT ENOUGH. THEY HAVE DONE A PHENOMENAL JOB IN ENGAGING THE NEIGHBORS HERE. AND THEY HAVE, THE NEIGHBORS ARE CHAMPIONS FOR THIS PROJECT. AND, YOU KNOW, IT'S THE DEVELOPER IS FEELING VERY INCLINED TO DELIVER EXACTLY WHAT HE'S TOLD THE NEIGHBORS THAT HE WANTS TO DELIVER. AND, PART OF MY, IN FRONT OF YOU ASKING TO CONTINUE TO BELIEVE AND INVEST IN THIS PROJECT IS BECAUSE I THINK THE CITY IS THE CITY SHOULD ALSO BE, REALLY BEHIND THIS DEVELOPER AND, AND HELPING THEM ACHIEVE THE VISION THAT THEY PUT FORTH TO THE NEIGHBORS. IT SEEMS JUST AN ALL AROUND SUCCESS STORY. AND I'M GLAD WE'RE SEEING THIS DIFFERENTIATION. SO THANK YOU VERY MUCH, JEFF. APPRECIATE IT. 
          COUNCILWOMAN FOWLER, THANK YOU. SO DO YOU ANTICIPATE ALL THE WHOLE 1.3 BEING UTILIZED FOR INFRASTRUCTURE? YES, I DO, COUNCILWOMAN. THEY, I IF AGAIN, WE'RE THERE MAY NEED TO BE THERE ARE GOING TO BE SOME ADDITIONAL COSTS. I EXPECT THOSE AGAIN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT $1.3 MILLION. SO IT'S A LOT OF MONEY. AND SO WHEN I SAY NOMINAL I DON'T MEAN TO SAY THAT IT MIGHT BE ANOTHER $100,000 IS GOING DIRECTLY TO THE REMEDIATION OF THE SITE, BUT IT'S GOING TO BE AROUND THAT 1,000,001.2, AMOUNT FOR, FOR THIS FOR THIS SITE. AND I EXPECT THAT ALL THAT MONEY WILL BE SPENT ON INFRASTRUCTURE BECAUSE WE'RE LOOKING AT THE DEVELOPER'S CAPITAL STACK AGAIN, THEY'RE GETTING SOME TAX CREDITS. I THINK THE KENTUCKY HOUSING CORPORATION IS GIVING THEM SOME ADDITIONAL TAX CREDITS, BUT THERE'S STILL SOME SOME GAPS IN THIS PROJECT, AND THEY'RE IN THE WEST END OPPORTUNITY, TIFF SO THERE IS NOT ANY OPPORTUNITY TO COME IN FRONT OF METRO COUNCIL TO CLOSE THAT GAP ANY FURTHER, WITH THE, WITH A WITH A TRADITIONAL DEVELOPMENT INCENTIVE, IF THERE IS SUCH A THING. SO I EXPECT THAT WE WILL USE THE REMAINING AMOUNTS OF THESE DOLLARS EITHER ON REMEDIATION OR INFRASTRUCTURE THAT IS DIRECTLY SERVING THE SITE. SO I GUESS MY SECOND QUESTION WOULD BE HOW MUCH, THE DEVELOPER IS PAYING FOR THE SITE OR IS HE, THAT'S TO BE DETERMINED YET WE HAVE NOT BROUGHT FORTH A SURPLUS RESOLUTION. OUR, DEVELOPMENT AGREEMENT, CONTEMPLATES A, A $1 SALE HERE. AGAIN, WE'VE HELD THIS PROPERTY FOR 30 YEARS, SO. OKAY. THANK YOU. COUNCILMAN OWE. THANK YOU. CHAIR, JEFF, WHEN A PROPERTY IS OWNED BY BY A BY THE PUBLIC. BY A BY BY A GOVERNMENT IS THE SAME PROCESS FOLLOWED IN 
          [00:50:08]
THE BROWNFIELDS PROCESS AS IT IS WITH A PRIVATE OWNER? IS THE END GAME A NO FURTHER ACTION LETTER? YES. SO WE'RE THERE IS, A NO FURTHER ACTION LETTER. IN THIS CASE, WE MEET AGAIN. THIS IS A 17 ACRE PARCEL. WE'VE REMEDIATED THE NORTHERN SIX AND A HALF ACRES OF THE SITE, WHICH ARE THE WHICH ARE THE EASIER WHICH IS THE EASIER PORTION OF THE SITE TO REMEDIATE? THERE WILL BE A NO FURTHER ACTION LETTER, AND THERE WILL BE AN ENVIRONMENTAL, AN AMENDED ENVIRONMENTAL COVENANT ON THE SITE BECAUSE WE'LL NEED TO THE COVENANT WILL NEED WE'RE GOING TO DO A SUBDIVISIONAL TECHNICAL STUFF THAT, YEAH, YOU SHOULD CARE ABOUT BUT DON'T NEED TO KNOW FOR THE PURPOSES OF THIS, BUT THERE WILL BE A MINOR PLAT THAT'S FILED, THAT HAS BEEN COMPLETED BY PLANNING, BY THE OFFICE OF PLANNING WILL FILE THAT. WE'LL FILE AN AMENDED ENVIRONMENTAL COVENANT THAT WILL RESTRICT THE USE ON THE SOUTHERN HALF, TO INDUSTRIAL AND WILL ALLOW THE MULTIFAMILY TO CONTINUE ON THE NORTHERN HALF. SO THE NORTHERN HALF WILL GET A NO FURTHER ACTION LETTER. AND THAT BASICALLY MEANS THAT IT IS SAFE FOR RESIDENTIAL USE. AND I, I'M ASSUMING HERE THAT THERE WAS GROUNDWATER REMEDIATION, SOIL REMEDIATION, AS OPPOSED TO RELYING ON CAPPING, CAPPING THE PROPERTY TO RECEIVE THAT NO FURTHER ACTION LETTER. THAT IS CORRECT. THEY THEY THEY'VE WE'VE BEEN MONITORING AND REMEDIATING THE GROUNDWATER. THAT PLUME IS AGAIN, MOSTLY TO THE SOUTH ON THE SOUTHERN PART OF THE SITE, WE DID THE CONTRACTOR DID SIGNIFICANT DIGGING ON THE SITE AT LEAST TEN FEET DOWN IN MOST AREAS ON THE NORTHERN HALF SURROUNDING THE EXISTING JONES DABNEY BUILDING. AND HOW MUCH MIGRATION WAS THERE OF THAT PLUME? WAS WERE THEY ABLE TO LIMIT AND MITIGATE ANY MIGRATION FROM FROM THAT UNDERWATER PLUME, THERE'S NOT BEEN A LOT OF MIGRATION OFF SITE. AGAIN, THE, I'M, I MIGHT GET MY I MIGHT HAVE MY SITE TOPOGRAPHY A LITTLE BACKWARD HERE, BUT THERE'S A PRESENT. THE NORFOLK SOUTHERN RAIL LINE IS RUNNING, RUNNING ALONG THE, THE EASTERN EDGE OF THE PROPERTY. SO THAT'S MITIGATING A LITTLE BIT BECAUSE IT'S REALLY THE, THE RAILROAD. AND THEN NINTH STREET, AND THE, THE PLUME IS IT HAS BEEN MOVING TO THE I BELIEVE IT WAS GOING TO THE SOUTH AND THE EAST ON THE SITE. I MIGHT HAVE THAT BACKWARD. IT MIGHT BE GOING TO THE NORTH AND THE WEST, BUT IT IS GOING IT IS IT IS NOT MIGRATED FAR OFF SITE. IT'S REALLY IN THE PUBLIC RIGHTS OF WAY OR THE RAILROAD RIGHT OF WAY AT THIS POINT IN TIME. OKAY. GREAT. THANK YOU. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS, I JUST ONE LAST ONE. 
          I THINK COUNCILWOMAN FOWLER'S POINT, WE'RE CLEARLY LOOKING. WE'RE WE'RE EXCITED ABOUT THE 60% AMI HOUSING. SO WE'RE CLEARLY LOOKING AT WORKING WITH THE DEVELOPER TO TRY AND FIND A WAY TO MAKE THAT HAPPEN, $1.3 MILLION IS A LOT OF MONEY TO ADD TO A PROJECT FOR SOMEONE, ESPECIALLY IN LIGHT OF THE FACT THAT THERE ARE OTHER BROWNFIELDS, SO, YOU KNOW, COUNCILMAN PIAGENTINI ASKED, THIS IS THIS WAS A BIG DEAL. I MEAN, $10 MILLION FOR ONE PROJECT IS A IS A BIG DEAL, WHERE IS OUR IF YOU HAD TO JUST POINT TO ONE, WHERE'S OUR NEXT PRIORITY? BROWNFIELD THE A BROWNFIELD THAT METRO OWNS? YES WELL, I'LL ANSWER THAT. I'LL THAT THIS MIGHT BE A SLIGHTLY CONTROVERSIAL ANSWER, BUT THE NEXT PRIORITY BROWNFIELD WOULD BE THE URBAN GOVERNMENT CENTER. OKAY WE DON'T WE DO NOT OWN A LOT OF LARGE BROWNFIELD SITES. 
          THE BROWNFIELD SITES THAT WE OWN, FOR THE MOST PART, ARE OLD LANDFILL SITES. SO THEY'RE REALLY NOT PRIME DEVELOPMENT SITES, THE YOU KNOW, A LOT OF PEOPLE ASK US ABOUT THE GIBSON LANE, PROPERTY THAT WE OWN, AND IT'S REALLY NOT A GREAT CANDIDATE BECAUSE IT'S FILL, IT'S WET, AND IT'S, IT REALLY BREAKING THE CAP ON THE LANDFILL IS YOU ALL MANY OF YOU HAVE EXPERIENCE WITH THAT SITUATION. WE HAD ON RIVER ROAD A FEW YEARS AGO. SO I THINK WE DON'T HAVE A LOT OF BIG BROWNFIELDS IN OUR INVENTORY. IT REALLY IS DOWN TO THE RHODIUS SITE AND THE URBAN GOVERNMENT CENTER SITE. THERE ARE, THERE WE ARE ACTUALLY IN THE PROCESS TO COUNCILMAN PIAGENTINI POINT, THERE ARE SOME STATE PROGRAMS THAT ARE LOOKING AT BROWNFIELDS, AND WE'RE ACTUALLY LOOKING AT A FEW, AT A AT A PROJECT WITH, SOME OF OUR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT PARTNERS OF ALLEGHENY AND THE WATER COMPANY, FOR EXAMPLE, AND GETTING THOSE SITES DEVELOPMENT READY THROUGH THE THROUGH SOME STATE PROGRAMS. THANK YOU. YEAH. SO I MEAN, THE GOAL FOR THIS 10 MILLION WAS RHODIA WAS A BIG DEAL. AND WE WERE HOPING TO GET THAT TAKEN CARE OF. IT SOUNDS LIKE WE HAVE THE 1.3 JUST AS COUNCILMAN PAT, AS COUNCILMAN PIAGENTINI SUGGESTED. HE KIND OF PUTS A BOW ON IT, IT ALSO DOESN'T SOUND LIKE THERE'S ANOTHER BIG PROJECT THAT MOVING 1.3 MILLION IS GOING TO CHANGE RADICALLY. WHAT'S GOING ON THERE? SO UNLESS I MISSED SOMETHING, COUNCILWOMAN 
          [00:55:03]
FOWLER. THANK YOU. OKAY, SO WE JUST ALLOCATED 63,000 FOR THE, STUDY, AND IN JEFFERSON MEMORIAL FOREST, I DON'T KNOW, I GO OUT ON A LIMB HERE AND SAY THAT IF THERE'S ANY FUNDING LEFT OVER IN THIS PROJECT THAT I WOULD LIKE TO SEE THAT GO TOWARDS, WHATEVER IS GOING TO HAPPEN THERE. YES, MA'AM. CAN I MAKE THAT IN A FORM OF AN AMENDMENT? I'M TRYING. I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S OUT OF LINE OR NOT. NO YOUR COUNCILPERSON, YOU CAN AMEND, I'M TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHAT YOUR WHAT WHAT YOU'RE AMENDING, WHAT YOU ARE PROPOSING. SO ANY REMEDIATION DOLLARS. BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT THIS IS REMEDIATION DOLLARS. I WOULD LIKE TO SEE THAT GO TOWARDS THE, THE STUDY AND OR WHATEVER HAS TO BE DONE ONCE THE STUDY IS COMPLETED AT THE JEFFERSON MEMORIAL FOREST. AND I THINK WE KNOW FOR A FACT THAT THERE'S GOING TO BE COST TO THAT. OKAY. THEN OKAY. THE I DON'T CARE IF IT'S $100,000, RIGHT? NO, I'M TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO HOW TO GET TO. I'M WHAT YOU'RE ASKING FOR, WHAT WHAT THIS AMENDMENT DOES IS IT CHANGES THE LANGUAGE FROM REMEDIATION TO INFRASTRUCTURE. MR, JEFF HAS ALREADY POINTED OUT THAT, ALL OF THE 1.3 MILLION WILL BE SPENT ON INFRASTRUCTURE, SO THERE WON'T BE ANY LEFT OVER, THERE WON'T BE ANY LEFT OVER, DO YOU. HE INDICATED THAT THERE MIGHT BE 100,000 LEFT OVER. NOW, THERE'S 100,000 IN REMEDIATION STILL TO BE DONE. THERE'S 100,000 OF REMEDIATION STILL TO BE DONE. AND SO WHAT HE SAID IS ONCE THEY FINISH WITH REMEDIATION, WHATEVER THAT NUMBER IS, WHETHER IT'S 100,000 MORE OR 600,000 MORE, WHEN THEY FINISH WITH REMEDIATION, WHATEVER IS LEFT OF THAT 1.3 MILLION WOULD BE USED FOR INFRASTRUCTURE ON THAT SITE. YEAH. AND AGAIN, I'M JUST, YOU KNOW, IF THE IF THE DEVELOPER IS BUYING THAT FOR A DOLLAR AND WE'RE TAKING REMEDIATION MONEY TO DO INFRASTRUCTURE, BUT I DON'T KNOW. THAT'S JUST MY THOUGHTS. NO, I HEAR YOU. IT'S JUST. YEAH. MR. CHAIRMAN, I'M ONE OF THE ONE THING THAT WE COULD DO TO GET TO COUNCILWOMAN FOWLER'S POINT. I DO, COUNCILWOMAN FOWLER. I DO THINK THAT WE WILL USE ALL THE FUNDS ON THIS PROJECT. AND THEY ARE THE. THEY ARE MOVING TOWARD A CLOSING WITH CGC. AND, I'LL BE LOOKING TO BRING A SURPLUS RESOLUTION TO THIS BODY, IN THE, IN THE COMING MONTHS. SO THEY'RE LOOKING TO CLOSE THIS THING BY THE END OF THIS YEAR. BUT WHAT WHAT MR. HILLENBRAND AND I ARE TALKING ABOUT IS PERHAPS INSTEAD OF TRYING TO SAY REMAINING FUNDS, WE TIME LIMIT THIS. SO, FOR EXAMPLE, IF WE GET TO THE END OF 25 AND WE HAVE NOT IDENTIFIED AND IF WE'VE NOT IDENTIFIED A, FUNDING SOURCE FOR WHAT'S GOING ON IN THE JEFFERSON MEMORIAL FOREST, THAT WE USE A PORTION OF THESE FUNDS TO REMEDIATE THAT, THAT WOULD BE THE THAT WOULD BE SOMETHING I COULD OFFER TO YOU THAT WAY. WE'RE NOT TRYING TO SIT HERE SAYING HOW MUCH MONEY COULD WE NOT? I DON'T THINK WE'LL HAVE FUNDS LEFT OVER, BUT WE'RE GOING TO BE AT A FAIL SAFE POINT. I BELIEVE WE NEED TO. I THINK WE NEED TO, HAVE THESE FUNDS ALLOCATED AND SPENT BY THE END OF 26. SO IN THIS CASE, IF WE I FEEL IF WE WERE AT THE END OF 25 AND WE DON'T SEE A PATH FORWARD FOR THIS PROJECT, WHICH I DON'T THINK IS THE CASE THAT WE COULD SHIFT IT TO THE JEFFERSON MEMORIAL FOREST, THAT WOULD BE MY SOMETHING I WOULD OFFER, MAYBE DANGEROUS, BUT LET ME JUST. I'LL MISS KEN HILDEBRAND AGAIN. ONE THING THAT WE'RE LOOKING TO DO WITH THIS PROJECT AND SEVERAL OF OUR PROJECTS, IS THE US TREASURY HAS SUGGESTED THAT STATES AND CITIES IMPLEMENT SOMETHING CALLED A INTERAGENCY AGREEMENT. AND WHAT THAT WOULD DO IS THIS WOULD ALLOW US TO THAT INTERAGENCY AGREEMENT WILL OBLIGATE THESE FUNDS. SO IF MR. O'BRIEN DOESN'T HAVE AN IDEA FOR OR HOW THEY'RE GOING TO USE THESE FUNDS UNTIL EARLY NEXT YEAR, BECAUSE WE ALL KNOW THAT OUR OBLIGATION DEADLINE IS DECEMBER 31ST, 2024. THE INTERAGENCY AGREEMENT ALLOWS WILL THE US TREASURY WILL RECOGNIZE THAT AS AN OBLIGATION. SO WHAT WE CAN DO IS AFTER AFTER IF SOMETHING COMES UP NEXT YEAR, WE STILL HAVE THE ABILITY TO MOVE THOSE FUNDS. I'LL GET DIRECTION FROM THE US TREASURY ON THIS. AND HOW MAYBE HOW THAT HOW THAT INTERAGENCY AGREEMENT NEEDS TO BE DRAFTED SO THAT WE COULD MOVE IT TO ANOTHER BROWNFIELD PROJECT. WHAT THAT MIGHT REQUIRE IS SOMETIME BETWEEN NOW AND THE END OF THE YEAR, WE CHANGE THE NAME OF THIS PROJECT FROM RODEO, RODEO, BROWNFIELD REMEDIATION TO BROWNFIELDS REMEDIATION. SO I DON'T I'M NOT I DON'T WANT TO SUGGEST THAT NOW BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW IF THAT WOULD DO THAT. BUT 
          [01:00:02]
WE CAN GO BACK AND TALK TO THE TREASURY ABOUT HOW WE CAN MAKE SURE THAT THAT WILL WORK PAST 20TH DECEMBER 31ST, 2024. WELL, I OBVIOUSLY DON'T HAVE ANY LANGUAGE IN FRONT OF ME, BUT WE'LL WORK WITH THE COUNTY ATTORNEY BETWEEN NOW AND NEXT THURSDAY TO DO JUST THAT. THANK YOU. SURE ANYONE ELSE? THIS IS AN ITEM REQUIRING A ROLL CALL. VOTE. MADAM CLERK, PLEASE OPEN. 
          THE VOTING IS OPEN. COUNCIL MEMBER MCCRANIE. YES. COUNCIL MEMBER. OWEN. YES COUNCIL MEMBE. 
          PARKER. YES. THANK YOU. VICE CHAIR EIGHT. YES VOTES. OKAY. IT PASSES UNANIMOUSLY AND WOULD GO TO CONSENT. BUT, AT THE REQUEST OF COUNCILWOMAN FOWLER, I'M GOING TO ASK THAT THIS BE SENT TO OLD BUSINESS. THANK YOU. ANYONE ELSE? THAT WAS THE LAST
* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.